No more racing at Laurel Park?

[Psychotic Parakeet]

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/racing-news/2010/november/03/maryland-jockey-club-plans-to-cease-live-racing-at-laurel-park.aspx

It is still a developing story, but what terrible news...

[second_glance]

My first track.

Worried about the horsemen and the horses; worried about the land.

[Songofthesword]

I'm worried about the track employees more than anything. The horseman for the most part will just relocate

[second_glance]

I'm worried about the track employees more than anything. The horseman for the most part will just relocate

Well, I was using the term "horsemen" in its most inclusive sense, but you are right to point out the employees.


[Long term, I guess I'm most concerned about the land. Last thing we need in the Mid-Atlantic is less open space and more McMansions and malls.]

[second_glance]

Worse than I thought:

Maryland Jockey Club President Tom Chuckas said it will not ask for live racing dates at Laurel for 2011 and current plans call for the facility to be converted to an off-track simulcasting outlet while rest of the property, including the stable area, is developed. He also said the Bowie training center would be closed.

The plan will be discussed at the Maryland Racing Commission meeting tentatively scheduled for November 23. Chuckas said this year’s fall racing at Laurel, scheduled to continue through December 18, would not be affected.

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/racing-news/2010/november/03/maryland-jockey-club-plans-to-cease-live-racing-at-laurel-park.aspx

:Cry: :Cry: :Cry:

[Songofthesword]

it sucks bu t this is good for racing as a whole. it's gonna hurt. But too much clutter. a few tracks over the next few years will be eaten up.

[Miss Woodford]

it sucks bu t this is good for racing as a whole. it's gonna hurt. But too much clutter. a few tracks over the next few years will be eaten up.
But what do you define as "racing as a whole"? That would include the thousands of people who make their livelihoods in racing; without them, the sport is nothing. Closing tracks just gets more people out of the business, and more spectators away from the track, which can only be a bad thing.

Laurel is nicer than Pimlico, it's got a fantastic turf course, and it's got a lot of history to it. It's not like this is some cheap llittle racino. Where does the Maryland Million go now? What of the De Francis Dash, Laurel Futurity, etc? Where do the Maryland-breds go when Pimlico is off? How does this plan affect Ocean Downs (which just got slots, so the Anne Arundel business doesn't affect them) and Timonium?

[Rick1323]

I don't get it. Pimlico is the dinosaur in Baltimore and it is in a much worse section of town. It seems like they are closing the wrong track. I love Laurel's turf course, but frankly most of the dirt fields are too small to bet.

[second_glance]

I don't get it. Pimlico is the dinosaur in Baltimore and it is in a much worse section of town. It seems like they are closing the wrong track. I love Laurel's turf course, but frankly most of the dirt fields are too small to bet.

They're going to put together a 40-day "elite meet" around the Preakness, which the state legislature did go out of its way to protect.

[Miss Woodford]

I don't get it. Pimlico is the dinosaur in Baltimore and it is in a much worse section of town. It seems like they are closing the wrong track. I love Laurel's turf course, but frankly most of the dirt fields are too small to bet.
Can't hold the Preakness at Laurel. The legislature is keeping MD racing hanging on by a thread because of the cash cow that is the Preakness. Otherwise they couldn't give a damn.

[WarEmblemluvr]

Can't hold the Preakness at Laurel. The legislature is keeping MD racing hanging on by a thread because of the cash cow that is the Preakness. Otherwise they couldn't give a damn.

This is so extremely depressing. I don't think alot of people in Anne Arundel county even knew what they were voting for. The Question A only talked about zoning - nothing explaining the situation with Arundel Mills and Laurel Park. Nobody understood what it would do to racing or the 10,000 or more jobs. I LOVE Laurel Park - it's a beautiful place to go to and it makes me sick to think that it will be gone by next year - I mean with no horses.
Why doesn't stupid Cordish step up and do something about this???

[Songofthesword]

This is so extremely depressing. I don't think alot of people in Anne Arundel county even knew what they were voting for. The Question A only talked about zoning - nothing explaining the situation with Arundel Mills and Laurel Park. Nobody understood what it would do to racing or the 10,000 or more jobs. I LOVE Laurel Park - it's a beautiful place to go to and it makes me sick to think that it will be gone by next year - I mean with no horses.
Why doesn't stupid Cordish step up and do something about this??? doubt very many people ever really know what they are voting for anymore.

[WaquoitNBroadBrush]

This is so extremely depressing. I don't think alot of people in Anne Arundel county even knew what they were voting for. The Question A only talked about zoning - nothing explaining the situation with Arundel Mills and Laurel Park. Nobody understood what it would do to racing or the 10,000 or more jobs. I LOVE Laurel Park - it's a beautiful place to go to and it makes me sick to think that it will be gone by next year - I mean with no horses.
Why doesn't stupid Cordish step up and do something about this???

Ballot questions are supposed to be worded as neutrally as possible. This was a zoning proposal. The impact on horse racing and jobs? That's for the "No" side to explain to the voters through advertising during the run-up to the vote. Did the MJC do much advertising and clearly explain what was at stake? What did the "Yes" side's advertising campaign look like? Not living in Maryland, all I know about the campaign is that there was a big "Vote No on Slots at the Mall" sign at the track that was constantly being shown on the simulcast feed. I doubt that message reached anyone who wasn't already going to vote no.

[GinTalking]

Where do the Maryland-breds go when Pimlico is off?

There haven't been any MD-bred races in decades (except for the small stakes which are funded by the bred fund). Maryland-bred or KY-bred ... doesn't matter. There are no maiden or allowance or claiming races open to only state breds so you will race wherever you can.

I love how people unaffected say "they will just relocate" as if moving your entire operation is easy. Where exactly do they go? Delaware may have open stalls. Fair Hill certainly does not. There's likely no room at Penn National or Charles Town ... unless they tell their "little people" to move so that the bigger guns can move in.

And for those of us who are based on a farm, and there are plenty of people who are, this means there will be nowhere to work the horses which in effect puts us out of business. You can train on a farm, but for a work, you have to have a full blown race track, particularly when you have young horses. Where do you go with them? Going to Laurel in the a.m. (wicked traffic on the beltway at rush hour) is a struggle, and it's only 50 miles away. Imagine what it would be like having to ship in for a work when the track is 80-90 miles away. Fun, fun, fun .... ;-(

[Songofthesword]

There haven't been any MD-bred races in decades (except for the small stakes which are funded by the bred fund). Maryland-bred or KY-bred ... doesn't matter. There are no maiden or allowance or claiming races open to only state breds so you will race wherever you can.

I love how people unaffected say "they will just relocate" as if moving your entire operation is easy. Where exactly do they go? Delaware may have open stalls. Fair Hill certainly does not. There's likely no room at Penn National or Charles Town ... unless they tell their "little people" to move so that the bigger guns can move in.

And for those of us who are based on a farm, and there are plenty of people who are, this means there will be nowhere to work the horses which in effect puts us out of business. You can train on a farm, but for a work, you have to have a full blown race track, particularly when you have young horses. Where do you go with them? Going to Laurel in the a.m. (wicked traffic on the beltway at rush hour) is a struggle, and it's only 50 miles away. Imagine what it would be like having to ship in for a work when the track is 80-90 miles away. Fun, fun, fun .... ;-( you are distorting the point.

the point is, the trainers are still going to have a way to make money. No one said that, ir's like laurel is going to have a relocation plan for the trainers or antyhing but most trainers are going to be able to run their horses somewhere and maintain their operation at the end of the day, the same can't be said for the teller at laurel or the guy who cooks hot dogs.

[Suni]

My first track.
Mine too. :pout:

[Laurierace]

Luckily I am closer to Delaware anyway. I will figure out a way to work and go there if need be. I do agree that a suitable place to work will be a huge challenge for many people however. I would think/hope that they would open the stable area at Pimlico year round if that is going to be the only track in the state but that remains to be seen.

[Vandalay]

OK here's something that I'd like to be cleared up..

Does the closing of Laurel mean the track is for sale? if not, why? I can't help but think that someone out there would buy it for racing..(Cordish even said he'd be interested)

..the quote of the day had to be from Tom Chuckas, who wondered why "a businessman with any acumen, would want to buy a racetrack that loses money..'

..this comes from someone works for a guy who owns SEVERAL racetracks that lose money..

[second_glance]

OK here's something that I'd like to be cleared up..

Does the closing of Laurel mean the track is for sale? if not, why? I can't help but think that someone out there would buy it for racing..(Cordish even said he'd be interested)



Cordish's people said again yesterday that they are interested in buying the track. The current owners are saying they won't sell to Cordish or other racing interests because (a) that's the only leverage they have left and (b) lots of money to be made (at least in theory) from selling most of it for development and building an OTB on the rest of it.

[Vandalay]

OK,..now the MJC is just being childish..

[second_glance]

OK,..now the MJC is just being childish..

Actually, that's me being incredibly sloppy and way too hasty in writing: The (a) isn't something they've said in public (to the best of my knowledge). It is, however, a reasonable interpretation of their position. I think there's some grandstanding, or giant game of chicken, still being played here. There's yet another hearing coming up later this month.

Sorry I wasn't more clear.

[Vandalay]

Well, if they're playing hadball, I think they're gonna lose..

The MD legislature has made it pretty clear that they don't care if racing stays or goes..I hope I'm wrong.

In retrospect, Magna/MJC totally blew it..they shot themselves in the foot at just about juncture, and are now holding peoples jobs as hostage..

[second_glance]

Well, if they're playing hadball, I think they're gonna lose..

The MD legislature has made it pretty clear that they don't care if racing stays or goes..I hope I'm wrong.

In retrospect, Magna/MJC totally blew it..they shot themselves in the foot at just about juncture, and are now holding peoples jobs as hostage..

A very accurate summation.

[Songofthesword]

Didn't all this come about becuase of Magna not wanting to pay a Licesensing fee or something along those lines?

[Miss Woodford]

OK here's something that I'd like to be cleared up..

Does the closing of Laurel mean the track is for sale? if not, why? I can't help but think that someone out there would buy it for racing..(Cordish even said he'd be interested)

..the quote of the day had to be from Tom Chuckas, who wondered why "a businessman with any acumen, would want to buy a racetrack that loses money..'

..this comes from someone works for a guy who owns SEVERAL racetracks that lose money..
Rosecroft Raceway is currently sitting empty, several acres of land and unoccupied stables just outside of Washington DC. Few developers are building now. It makes more sense to at least keep Laurel/Bowie open to training until they actually get sold.

I think this will be a Suffolk Downs zombie track situation where nobody knows if racing will continue the next season, but somehow it does.

[Laurierace]

It makes absolutely no sense to keep either of them open until they are sold. Not that I want to close them but it is a couple hundred thousand EACH to keep them open monthly.

[leveeguy]

I think the first thing to take away from all this is that the Maryland Jockey Club clearly hasn't given up on getting slots at either Laurel or Pimlico.

If they had, I think they would indeed have put their tracks up for sale. After all, they got multiple bids earlier this year when Magna was in bankruptcy.

The second thing to remember is that some of these proposals require action by the state racing commission. Racing dates are set by the racing commission. And an OTB or simulcast facility at Laurel may also require approval -- if not from the racing commission, then from some other state agency.

I don't know how they plan to make another swing at slots, but I think you'll see it.

I just wish people's livelihoods weren't being threatened in the process.

[Songofthesword]

I actually tried to play laurel today. This is just pitiful

[Prairie Bayou]

At the end of the day to them it's just money. Magna does not care about the people involved or the horse breeders that are but out of business. They made that clear a long time ago. I wish I could transplant myself back 30 years. I hate being so angry about something I can't control.

[Songofthesword]

At the end of the day to them it's just money. Magna does not care about the people involved or the horse breeders that are but out of business. They made that clear a long time ago. I wish I could transplant myself back 30 years. I hate being so angry about something I can't control.
how is this any different from any other business anywhere in the country? are they supposed to bleed money becuase horseman are there and them closing down will effect alot of people? Not trying to come off as snobbish or amything but they are at wits end here.

[Intelligent Male]

In this market I don't see that property as that attractive to develop.

Magna's "not for sale - we're going to develop the property" tact is as some have suggested a ploy to leverage the stat to give them something.

As far as the Bowie closing, by law, the Bowie property becomes the property of the state if it's not being used as a horse training center so Magna gets nothing for that (just saving the expenses of keeping it open and maintaining it).

Would love to see Colonial greatly expand their meet but that's not likely.

[GinTalking]

you are distorting the point.

the point is, the trainers are still going to have a way to make money. No one said that, ir's like laurel is going to have a relocation plan for the trainers or antyhing but most trainers are going to be able to run their horses somewhere and maintain their operation at the end of the day, the same can't be said for the teller at laurel or the guy who cooks hot dogs.

Hon, I get that too. I know a lot of the people who are employed at Laurel. I get it. I was simply addressing one side of the issue. No distortion goin' on ... it's all part of the big picture.

[GinTalking]

In this market I don't see that property as that attractive to develop.



Get the word out that there are two eagles living on those wetlands that is Laurel Park. :-)

[leveeguy]

A ``reprieve,'' from Uncle Frank:

http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/bs-bz-hancock-stronach-tracks-20101109,0,5377508.column

[Intelligent Male]

Rosecroft Raceway is currently sitting empty, several acres of land and unoccupied stables just outside of Washington DC. Few developers are building now. It makes more sense to at least keep Laurel/Bowie open to training until they actually get sold.

I think this will be a Suffolk Downs zombie track situation where nobody knows if racing will continue the next season, but somehow it does.

And Chucklehead Chuckas was at Rosecroft before the Maryland Jockey Club. Quite the whiz kid that one with a great record of running tracks into bankruptcy.

Per the latest article it looks like either Frank is throwing Chuckas under the bus or he threw himself under there.

[GinTalking]

Interesting turn of events. The one thing about all of this is that Stronach, of all the folks in the industry, actually does have a dog in this fight. I don't know what will happen, but if you think about it, Stronach is still buying horses (what'd he pay for someone the other day ... a mil or more, wasn't it). Horses he bred are running in Maryland too, every week. It only makes sense to keep that flow going.

I know the folks at Bowie wouldn't think like this, but when they closed Pimlico to training, they wrecked a lot of people's lives. I'm not sure the same could be said by closing Bowie. I know people live nearby, but Laurel and Bowie are only 10-15 minutes apart ... whereas folks who used to train or ship in to work at Pimlico are now transplanted by at least an hour, I'd think.

I've made that ride down to Laurel in the a.m. (albeit not daily) and it's not much fun. The traffic on the beltway starts early and is still there on the ride home at 10 a.m. It's stop and go, even then. I doubt anyone actually moved when they moved the Pimlico folks to Laurel or Bowie, but it sure messed with their commute. Some of my family ships to Laurel to work while others drive from home to Bowie every day. That's a real haul folks ... something like a 60 mile one-way morning drive. You do that every morning at 4 a.m. and see how long you can last (keeping in mind that a lot of people who do make the same kind of commute often have a six figure paycheck at the end of their drive). It is the kind of thing one does when they want to live in Frederick or Clarksville, but work in D.C. because the big bucks are there. These folks aren't pulling in that kind of money. They are likely barely getting by, all just to try to win a few claiming races that might get you through a few months.

I know. That sounds dramatic, but it's a fact. So, close Bowie ... move those people back to Laurel and Pimlico and for shippers to work, they'd have two choices. I hope they can work out something along those lines.

But I'm not holding my breath. I'd try desperately to keep my mare, but I doubt I could afford to keep the other three in training if Maryland racing ceases. It would just be too hard on a daily basis.

I'm not a fan of the MTHA, but good for Richard for trying to talk to Stronach in a non-confrontational atmosphere.

[Laurierace]

I have been saying close Bowie and keep Pimlico open for years Gin. Too bad nobody asks us! Anyway, if true this is welcome news but it really doesn't help their credibility much. So many threats, so little follow through.

[Vandalay]

While I'm happy that racing will continue, I'm afraid that it'll be more MAGNA "business as usual"....

As far a selling properties go,..selling Bowie is a no-brainer..it's situated right in the middle of a residential area, therefore making it more attractive to developers...I'd like to think Frank would use part of the proceeds from the sale as "matching funds" from slots revenue to make some improvements, but with his debt, I'm not holding my breath...

[Laurierace]

They can't sell Bowie but they can stop paying to run the place.

[Laurierace]

Guess we'll see who wins this battle.
http://www.baltimoresun.com/business/bs-bz-penn-reaction-stronach-20101109,0,1309804,print.story

[leveeguy]

Well, now that he has cast himself as the savior of Maryland racing (after his company threatened to destroy it, mind you), it will be interesting to see what Uncle Frank asks for.

Hey, California folks, any of this sound familiar? Create a crisis, swoop in to save the day, in return ask the horsemen to back your proposals for ...

[Songofthesword]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bs-ed-racing-serio-20101115,0,7564266.story

[GinTalking]

Wow, what a misguided, incorrect, silly article that is. There are so many holes in it, it's not even worth commenting on.

[Whos the Cowboy]

The fallacy is that NJ is as close to ending horse racing as MD is, despite the 2010 summer meet at Monmouth