Zenyatta News

[Indychase]

I actually like landing in San Francisco, with all the water. I freak landing or watching others land in San Diego. So many buildings...

Yeah, landing in SD is bad. I like both SF and Oakland (my 'home' airport).

[Ezariah]

http://www.equibase.com/images/stablemail.gif
Zenyatta (http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqpHorseMPPByHorse.cfm?refno=7156465&SAP=HPV&BT=TB) (6-Year-Old Mare)

Date: June 27, 2010
Track: HOLLYWOOD PARK
Distance: Four Furlongs
Time: 49:60 Breezing
Track Condition: Fast
Surface: All Weather Track
Rank: 38/65

[weatherbird]

Trainer John Shirreffs watched superstar Zenyatta jog on the training track Thursday in her first appearance on the track since winning her third straight Vanity Handicap under 129 pounds Sunday to extend her unbeaten streak to a record 17.

"Just getting a little exercise" said Shirreffs, who estimated a decision for her next start would be made in about two weeks.

http://www.calracing.com/stable_notes.php?f=hudsonlandingarrivesforwillroge rs

http://www.drf.com/news/article/114256.html
On Sunday, Shirreffs stopped short of committing Zenyatta to the $300,000 Clement Hirsch Stakes over 1 1/16 miles at Del Mar on Aug. 7.
"We haven't really discussed it yet," he said. "We've got lots of time."

[Man o' Taz]

http://www.drf.com/news/article/114256.html
On Sunday, Shirreffs stopped short of committing Zenyatta to the $300,000 Clement Hirsch Stakes over 1 1/16 miles at Del Mar on Aug. 7.
"We haven't really discussed it yet," he said. "We've got lots of time."

They haven't really discussed it except for the other statements he made on the subject...:becky:

Zenyatta aimed at Hirsch three-peat
http://www.ntra.com/content/display/news/NDU4MjA=

INGLEWOOD, Calif. - Zenyatta's appearance in the $250,000 Vanity Handicap at Hollywood Park on Sunday is likely to be the first of two races for the popular 6-year-old mare in Southern California this summer.

Wednesday, trainer John Shirreffs said the $300,000 Clement Hirsch Stakes at Del Mar on Aug. 7, a race that Zenyatta won in 2008 and 2009, will be a late summer goal. Races on the East Coast had entered the discussions, but Shirreffs and owners Jerry and Ann Moss intend to leave her in Southern California for now.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/horse/news/story?id=5289575

Updated: June 15, 2010, 3:48 PM ET
Zenyatta may see St Trinians again


By Steve Andersen
Daily Racing Form

Shirreffs said he wants to see how the Del Mar Polytrack surface performs in the early weeks of the meeting, which begins on July 21, before committing Zenyatta. Since it was installed before the 2007 meeting, Del Mar's synthetic surface has been inconsistent on some days, with tighter conditions during the cool and often overcast hours of morning training followed by looser conditions in the afternoon, with exposure to a strong summer sun.
"We won't really commit until we know what Del Mar is like," Shirreffs said. "When it's loose, racing is very different on it. When it's tight, training is very different on it. We have to hope they find a happy medium for it."
If Zenyatta skips Del Mar, she could be sent to the East Coast, although Shirreffs seemed cool to that idea on Monday.
"How many times do you really want to cross the country," he said. The Breeders' Cup Classic at Churchill Downs in November is Zenyatta's long-term goal.
Shirreffs emphasized that a decision on Zenyatta's next start will be made only in the days before the Clement Hirsch. "It will be very late," he said.

The only problem with their plan...waiting until they see how the Del Mar surface is playing...is that if it does not play well..they will have missed the shot of a race at HP in the HGC by then...and have no choice to ship her...so in reality no matter how the track comes up...they are between a rock and a hard place and Zenyatta will likely run there since sending her to the BC with only one race in three months will be a tough way to try and guarantee her fitness.

[ElPrado1]

I don't see where it was written in stone that she had to go to the East Coast. Why should she be the only horse in history that has to have a schedule dictated by someone other than her connections? Any other trainer or owner can run where they want to. I don't see Rachel being required to run at specific tracks. I don't see Pletcher having to write in stone which track QR runs at. Their connections aren't being told they have to go to California. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. The whole point of her going east was supposed to be to run against one or the other. If she went to NY, Rachel would run back to Ky. QR would wind up in Canada or Ky or Chicago. I consider Jackson the biggest hypocrite in the horse world.

[GinTalking]

Where's the news?

[Man o' Taz]

I don't see where it was written in stone that she had to go to the East Coast. Why should she be the only horse in history that has to have a schedule dictated by someone other than her connections? Any other trainer or owner can run where they want to. I don't see Rachel being required to run at specific tracks. I don't see Pletcher having to write in stone which track QR runs at. Their connections aren't being told they have to go to California. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. The whole point of her going east was supposed to be to run against one or the other. If she went to NY, Rachel would run back to Ky. QR would wind up in Canada or Ky or Chicago. I consider Jackson the biggest hypocrite in the horse world.

It is not written in stone. And if you have been paying attention, based upon hearing how she came back dehydrated from the Appple Blossom, while I would love to see her race on the East Coast, I have been arguing against her shipping again except for the BC.

But logically speaking, if her connections wait to see the Del Mar conditions...they wait until after the Del Mar meet starts on July 21st...the week after the Delaware Handicap...on July 17th...say the track conditions come up awful from their standpoint. Where are they going to race Zenyatta now? They missed the DelCap. They missed the HGC. So now they are forced to choose between a turf race at Del Mar, and shipping her East which they do not want to do.

Do you understand the point I am making right now?

My point had nothing to do with her facing other horses out East.

Her connections have basically have committed to running in the Clement Hirsch no matter what the track conditions are because the alternative from their point of view is too risky. So, why don't they just say they are running in the race?

And Pletcher has written in stone which track Quality Road is running at. He said he was running in the Whitney and the Woodward long ago and then shipping to the BC with no other races.

As for why they were running in the East, Moss has said that he would love to run her in his home state of New York...particularly in New York, and Zenyatta's schedule IF YOU RECALL was never about who she was facing - though last year they did allow that they might ship Z to NY to face Rachel in the Beldame. Their opinion has been we are running where we are running and if Rachel or whoever shows up so be it. So, I think you are engaging in some revisionist history here.

And while we have a disagreement about Jackson ducking anyone, Quality Road has certainly never ducked anyone so I think that that is pretty unfair for you to suggest that QR would evade Zenyatta when he was the horse that tried to race against her on her home turf at Santa Anita. :rolleyes:

[Sheepish]

I would love to see Zenyatta run against St Trinians again. That last race was far more exciting than I thought it would be! I don't know that Trinians ever really stands a chance to beat her, but Z sure had to work to get there in time.

I'm not sure why anyone thinks Z's presence in NY would send Rachel "running back to KY" It's not like one has been chasing the other on a chess board this year, they may as well be in seperate countries. I still don't get why people who hate Rachel talk about her so much, if they don't consider her a threat. I wonder, if you counted up how many posts are about which mare in this thread, who would win?

@Gin, indeed.

[Man o' Taz]

I would love to see Zenyatta run against St Trinians again. That last race was far more exciting than I thought it would be! I don't know that Trinians ever really stands a chance to beat her, but Z sure had to work to get there in time.

I'm not sure why anyone thinks Z's presence in NY would send Rachel "running back to KY" It's not like one has been chasing the other on a chess board this year, they may as well be in seperate countries. I still don't get why people who hate Rachel talk about her so much, if they don't consider her a threat. I wonder, if you counted up how many posts are about which mare in this thread, who would win?

@Gin, indeed.

What sheepish said... :clap:

[The Tin Man]

What sheepish said... :clap:

Just so the record is clear here on where I stand.

Anyone here knows MY issue is with Jackson ... I have NO issue with Rachel amd tend to say she's a great horse in pretty much anything I post related to her.

She can't help who her owner is. I can't stand Jackson. I like Rachel just fine. :)

[Rick1323]

Nothing to see here folks.....let's move along please.

If only I had a nightstick.

[Horse's Rear]

Where's the news?

http://www.drf.com/news/article/114256.html


I'm not sure why anyone thinks Z's presence in NY would send Rachel "running back to KY" It's not like one has been chasing the other on a chess board this year, they may as well be in seperate countries.
Zenyatta tried chasing her in the midwest this spring, but Rachel had too big a headstart and couldn't be overtaken.

As we move into the second half of the year, you have to think that the advantage begins to swing to the more lightly campaigned younger filly.

[Man o' Taz]

Nothing to see here folks.....let's move along please.

If only I had a nightstick.

If only we had access to the power cord on your computer... :becky:



Posted on Monday, 06.28.10
Quality Road cuts into Zenyatta's lead

By Sports Network
The Sports Network
Week 18 of the NTRA National Poll once again showed no significant changes among the top 10. However, leading racehorse Zenyatta had her lead over Quality Road slightly reduced.
Zenyatta, undefeated in 17 career starts, leads Quality Road by five points, one less than last week. The six-year-old champion mare received 13 first- place votes and 179 points. The 2009 Breeders' Cup Classic winner could make her next start in the Clement L. Hirsch at Del Mar on Saturday, August 7.
Quality Road, perfect in three starts in 2010, has six first-place votes and 174 points. The four-year-old colt will make his next start in the Whitney Handicap at Saratoga Race Course on August 7.
The next four spots in the poll are unchanged from last week: Blame (115), Rachel Alexandra (110), Lookin At Lucky (104) and Rail Trip (60).
Super Saver, 46 points, moves up one spot to seventh and Misremembered dropped to eighth with 41 points. Tuscan Evening (32) and Blind Luck (30) round out the top 10.

Read more: http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/2...#ixzz0sG7s11I6 (http://www.miamiherald.com/2010/06/28/1704966/quality-road-cuts-into-zenyattas.html#ixzz0sG7s11I6)

[islandgirl45]

http://www.drf.com/news/article/114256.html


Zenyatta tried chasing her in the midwest this spring, but Rachel had too big a headstart and couldn't be overtaken.

As we move into the second half of the year, you have to think that the advantage begins to swing to the more lightly campaigned younger filly.

Huh? Not following this, especially since Rachel was pulled from the Apple Blossom because of her loss in the New Orleans Ladies.
Also, haven't both Rachel and Zen been campaigned the same this year? One isn't more "lightly raced" than the other.

[Slewbopper]

Do you understand the point I am making right now?



No

[Horse's Rear]

Huh? Not following this, especially since Rachel was pulled from the Apple Blossom because of her loss in the New Orleans Ladies.
Also, haven't both Rachel and Zen been campaigned the same this year? One isn't more "lightly raced" than the other.
Zenyatta heard about a sighting of Rachel in Louisiana and flew to Arkansas to try and catch her before she got away, but Rachel had heard from Zardana that she was coming and caught a quick bus up to Louisville and got away.

Zenyatta has reeled off three G1 victories; Rachel began the year in an ungraded stakes, lost a G2 and then won a G2. She is rounding into form with the real serious racing in front of her, and definitely looks ready for G1 racing now. Given how horses career trajectories usually go, you'd have to give her a slightly better shot at a strong summer and fall than the older mare. Though you have to acknowledge that the older mare has been knocking 'em out pretty consistently for a lot longer than anyone had a right to expect.

[FastG45]

How about this scenario?

Zen goes in the “Personal Ensign”

Rachel goes in the “Ruffian”

QR and the rest of the boys battle it out in the “Whitney” and the “Woodward”

These would be easy spots for both the girls. It would also keep the public guessing on the main contenders. They still would not have run against each other so there’s no comparison. The who’s ducking who trash talk would continue and we all know how much fun that is.

[Horse's Rear]

How about this scenario?

Zen goes in the “Personal Ensign”

Rachel goes in the “Ruffian”

QR and the rest of the boys battle it out in the “Whitney” and the “Woodward”

It sounds like a Saratoga marketing director's wet dream.

What is the fetish that this board has with trying to cram all the best horses into one racetrack?

What about this concept: horses race at tracks all across America, with certain individuals emerging as dominant in their geographical region. Then, near the end of the year, we have one big day of racing, wake up the rest of America, and tell them that all the best horses from around the country (who are still in good racing condition) are going to run against each other and any horses who want to ship in from other countries for a lot of money?

Nah, that would never work.

[littlelate]

If she goes to Del Mar I'm (painfully) betting against her. If she doesn't like the track, facing a horse as strong as St T there is probably a really bad idea.

[MonmouthGuy]

Also, haven't both Rachel and Zen been campaigned the same this year? One isn't more "lightly raced" than the other.

Z's campaign never ended as she was never taken out of training. She will definitely have the more draining campaign this year. The longer they wait to meet, logic holds that it would work to Rachel's advantage as the younger, fresher horse. That is why if I were connections of Z, I would wait until Jackson announces where Rachel is going next and then meet her there. However, Jackson's gamesmanship makes this impossible by waiting until a race is drawn before announcing where she will go.

[littlelate]

How well has that "fresher horse" thing worked out so far for Rachel?

[MonmouthGuy]

How well has that "fresher horse" thing worked out so far for Rachel?

Now that Draynay is gone you're the frontrunner for the least informed and most intellectually challenged poster on this forum. I was not going to respond to your idiocy, because you were too dumb to understand my post, which was actually complimenting Zenyatta for essentially running a two-year campaign, but I will try,

It has worked out fairly well, as the third off the layoff was Rachel's best race and she should be peaking in the late summer/fall. Zenyatta has never been taken out of training and Sheriffs has done a great job of keeping her in peak form. As a result, he has a tougher job than ***-man the second half of the season.

[MonmouthGuy]

n/t

[islandgirl45]

It sounds like a Saratoga marketing director's wet dream.

What is the fetish that this board has with trying to cram all the best horses into one racetrack?

What about this concept: horses race at tracks all across America, with certain individuals emerging as dominant in their geographical region. Then, near the end of the year, we have one big day of racing, wake up the rest of America, and tell them that all the best horses from around the country (who are still in good racing condition) are going to run against each other and any horses who want to ship in from other countries for a lot of money?

Nah, that would never work.


Hey, that's a great idea! We could call it the Breeders Cup! Or you know, we could pick another name if someone has a snappier one.

[Horse's Rear]

How well has that "fresher horse" thing worked out so far for Rachel?
Right now, I'd have to say it's working real well.

Of course, I'm one of those people who believes that fall is a championship season and that the horse who rules the autumn rules.

[Man o' Taz]

Right now, I'd have to say it's working real well.

Of course, I'm one of those people who believes that fall is a championship season and that the horse who rules the autumn rules.

And the rest of the year be damned?

Seems a little shortsighted.

My feeling is that you need encouragement for horses to run all year and while I agree the fall is the championship season, I believe the rest of the year to be important as well.

I think Zenyatta's connections realize this fact in 2010 which is why she will be running in all Grade I races this year -- starting in March rather than May. I also think they realize another fact as well, that in order to win HOTY a horse needs to be campaigned. Unfortunately, their experience at Oaklawn Park this year put a hitch in their plans of campaigning her more widely. And this is why I fully support their intentions of keeping her in CA until the Breeders Cup as a result.

[Man o' Taz]

How about this scenario?

Zen goes in the “Personal Ensign”

Rachel goes in the “Ruffian”

QR and the rest of the boys battle it out in the “Whitney” and the “Woodward”

These would be easy spots for both the girls. It would also keep the public guessing on the main contenders. They still would not have run against each other so there’s no comparison. The who’s ducking who trash talk would continue and we all know how much fun that is.

Zenyatta came back dehydrated from the Apple Blossom and as a result her connections are very skeptical about shipping her again. I respect that and while I would love to see her participate in a race at Saratoga, I would rather she be in her best form possible for the BC. The only course I would urge different from the one her folks have charted is the Hollywood Gold Cup. I think she would beat Rail Trip and have more than enough time to recover for the Zenyatta and BC Classic. A victory there would cement her as the best horse in training and a victory in the BC Classic would cement her as HOTY.

It would allow her to avoid racing at Del Mar.

I find it difficult to believe that she will be HOTY without facing males before the BC even with a victory there and I think that would be a shame because I do believe she is the best horse in training this year.

[Horse's Rear]

And the rest of the year be damned?

Seems a little shortsighted.

My feeling is that you need encouragement for horses to run all year and while I agree the fall is the championship season, I believe the rest of the year to be important as well.
You are only disagreeing with yourself.

I never said "the rest of the year be damned"--you did.

I said that the horse who has struggled in the early part of the year looks to be coming into top form at the time in the calendar when it is most important to be coming into form. With any luck at all, she will enter the fall off a 4-race campaign with back-to-back victories and her first G1 win of the year. That's a horse headed in the right direction with something left for the major races. Last year, at that time, she was wrung out and running on fumes.

And while you agree this year that fall is the championship season, that was not your position last year. I can understand why you change your view.

[Man o' Taz]

You are only disagreeing with yourself.

I never said "the rest of the year be damned"--you did.

I said that the horse who has struggled in the early part of the year looks to be coming into top form at the time in the calendar when it is most important to be coming into form. With any luck at all, she will enter the fall off a 4-race campaign with back-to-back victories and her first G1 win of the year. That's a horse headed in the right direction with something left for the major races. Last year, at that time, she was wrung out and running on fumes.

And while you agree this year that fall is the championship season, that was not your position last year. I can understand why you change your view.

Actually to correct you, I never "said it" --- I asked you a question -- giving a jab at your unreasonable position last year which IMHO gave undue weight to "the fall championship season" occurring on the Pro Ride surface?

I have not changed my view at all. The fall is championship season. I have always believed that. The horses that participate and perform well should be lauded. However, I also believe that winning a championship is not the "be all end all" for determining who the champion should be. It is but one factor to be considered. Granted, it should be given more weight than other races, but not so much as to make irrelevant other efforts. A horse that steps up in class repeatedly can easily outweigh the premium placed on winning a "championship" race. You should know this quite well, my friend. The vote last year was not even close.

Nice attempt at twisting the meaning of my words in the post at least two times carb...:)

[Horse's Rear]

Actually to correct you, I never "said it" --- I asked you a question -- giving a jab at your unreasonable position last year which IMHO gave undue weight to "the fall championship season" occurring on the Pro Ride surface?
Your jab missed.

My position last year was completely reasonable and consistent with my position this year. The most important season every year is the fall; last year, Rachel missed it and Zenyatta dominated it.

Youth, exhilaration and excitement always have a seductive appeal; it's difficult for people to look beyond it. This year, we don't have so much of that distracting us.

[Man o' Taz]

Your jab missed.

My position last year was completely reasonable and consistent with my position this year. The most important season every year is the fall; last year, Rachel missed it and Zenyatta dominated it.

Youth, exhilaration and excitement always have a seductive appeal; it's difficult for people to look beyond it. This year, we don't have so much of that distracting us.

Yes, well, I think the more reasonable position won out...overwhelmingly...

Voters were not enamored so much with youth, as they were with a horse stepping up in class and challenging herself...something that one horse did 3-4 times and another horse did once...

Bloodhorse had its poll...

Well Armed (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/well-armed/2003?source=BHonline) blows away the field in the Dubai World Cup
• I Want Revenge (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/i-want-revenge/2006?source=BHonline) overcomes a horrific start to capture the Wood Memorial
• Rachel Alexandra (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/rachel-alexandra/2006?source=BHonline) runs off with the Kentucky Oaks by more than 20 lengths
• Mine That Bird (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/mine-that-bird/2006?source=BHonline) posts stunning, 50-1 upset in the Kentucky Derby
• Rachel Alexandra turns back the late charge of Mine That Bird in the Preakness
• Presious Passion (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/presious-passion/2003?source=BHonline) fires out to a 20-length lead en route to course record win in United Nations
• Rachel Alexandra toys with the boys in the Haskell Invitational
• Gio Ponti (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/gio-ponti/2005?source=BHonline) captures his fourth consecutive grade I score in the Arlington Million
• Rachel Alexandra holds off her male elders in the Woodward Stakes
• Linda Rice becomes the first woman to win the Saratoga training title
• Summer Bird (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/summer-bird/2006?source=BHonline) registers historic triumph in the Jockey Club Gold Cup
• Goldikova (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/goldikova-ire/2005?source=BHonline) wins her second straight Breeders’ Cup Mile
• Conduit (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/conduit-ire/2005?source=BHonline) runs down the stubborn Presious Passion for a repeat score in the Breeders’ Cup Turf
• Zenyatta (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/zenyatta/2004?source=BHonline) remains undefeated and becomes first female to win the Breeders’ Cup Classic

Which is why Z received moment of the year as she deserved and Rachel received Horse of the Year as she deserved...

One "moment" does not a year make...but you and Zenyatta's connections can stick to your tried and true way of thinking...and she'll lose another HOTY tally...

She needs at least two moments...she missed out on one in not having Rachel race in the Apple Blossom...

She'll miss out on another not taking on Rail Trip in the HGC...

This time to another older horse...in QR

Who has several moments of the year in:

A 122 BSF in the Donn Handicap...breaking track record...

Second fastest time in the Met Mile...

And he'll likely get at least one more record at Saratoga...for a third moment and then the BC...

Or a fellow CA youthful upstart and fellow Preakness winner in LAL after he wins the Haskell, Travers, Goodwood and BC Classic...

LAL winning the Preakness defeating the Kentucky Derby winner Super Saver for the first time

LAL winning the Haskell with the deepest field in race history

LAL winning the Goodwood over Rail Trip

Wouldn't that be an interesting stat...the last four HOTYs go to a horse that won the Preakness Stakes...

Curlin - Preakness 2007 won in 07 and 08
Rachel - Preakness 09
LAL - Preakness 10

[The Tin Man]

Yes, well, I think the more reasonable position won out...overwhelmingly...

Voters were not enamored so much with youth, as they were with a horse stepping up in class and challenging herself...something that one horse did 3-4 times and another horse did once...

Bloodhorse had its poll...

Well Armed (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/well-armed/2003?source=BHonline) blows away the field in the Dubai World Cup
• I Want Revenge (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/i-want-revenge/2006?source=BHonline) overcomes a horrific start to capture the Wood Memorial
• Rachel Alexandra (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/rachel-alexandra/2006?source=BHonline) runs off with the Kentucky Oaks by more than 20 lengths
• Mine That Bird (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/mine-that-bird/2006?source=BHonline) posts stunning, 50-1 upset in the Kentucky Derby
• Rachel Alexandra turns back the late charge of Mine That Bird in the Preakness
• Presious Passion (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/presious-passion/2003?source=BHonline) fires out to a 20-length lead en route to course record win in United Nations
• Rachel Alexandra toys with the boys in the Haskell Invitational
• Gio Ponti (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/gio-ponti/2005?source=BHonline) captures his fourth consecutive grade I score in the Arlington Million
• Rachel Alexandra holds off her male elders in the Woodward Stakes
• Linda Rice becomes the first woman to win the Saratoga training title
• Summer Bird (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/summer-bird/2006?source=BHonline) registers historic triumph in the Jockey Club Gold Cup
• Goldikova (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/goldikova-ire/2005?source=BHonline) wins her second straight Breeders’ Cup Mile
• Conduit (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/conduit-ire/2005?source=BHonline) runs down the stubborn Presious Passion for a repeat score in the Breeders’ Cup Turf
• Zenyatta (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/thoroughbred/zenyatta/2004?source=BHonline) remains undefeated and becomes first female to win the Breeders’ Cup Classic

Which is why Z received moment of the year as she deserved and Rachel received Horse of the Year as she deserved...

One "moment" does not a year make...but you and Zenyatta's connections can stick to your tried and true way of thinking...and she'll lose another HOTY tally...

She needs at least two moments...she missed out on one in not having Rachel race in the Apple Blossom...

She'll miss out on another not taking on Rail Trip in the HGC...

This time to another older horse...in QR

Who has several moments of the year in:

A 122 BSF in the Donn Handicap...breaking track record...

Second fastest time in the Met Mile...

And he'll likely get at least one more record at Saratoga...for a third moment and then the BC...

Or a fellow CA youthful upstart and fellow Preakness winner in LAL after he wins the Haskell, Travers, Goodwood and BC Classic...

LAL winning the Preakness defeating the Kentucky Derby winner Super Saver for the first time

LAL winning the Haskell with the deepest field in race history

LAL winning the Goodwood over Rail Trip

Wouldn't that be an interesting stat...the last four HOTYs go to a horse that won the Preakness Stakes...

Curlin - Preakness 2007 won in 07 and 08
Rachel - Preakness 09
LAL - Preakness 10

I love Lucky, but if he's ever on the same track with Rail Trip ... He will NOT finish ahead of him ... You continue to sell Rail Trip short ... But in time you'll understand just how good he truly is Taz ...

And I know you still care about HOY, but I could care less if Zenny wins it ... My focus is staying undefeated and closing out her career with another Classic win ...

I suspect that's Shirreffs and the Moss' goal also ... Not HOY

[Horse's Rear]

MoT, I don't think about horses and horse racing the way you do.

You speak of this stuff as though the goal were to win an election, and that's how you make your decisions.

I think of this as a sport, where you try to do the right thing with your horse; and at the end of the year, there is a separate banquet that recognizes performance. The banquet is secondary to the sport, not the reason for the sport.

I think Zenyatta faces a huge challenge this year, because she is six years old and campaigned through the fall to the biggest race of the year last year, then never really left training going into this year. Trying to set up a campaign that will allow her to peak again in the fall at her age is extremely difficult.

I think Quality Road faces a very different challenge, trying to sustain soundness when he has a very large body that runs very fast on very small feet. Those two seem the clear top horses to have performed thus far this year; and for me, that means that we still have a long way to go before we begin deciding who was the best horse to race this year.

If either one of those horses sustains performance at the level that they have established for the rest of the year, it will be difficult to look past them to anyone else. But both of them have serious question marks as to the question of whether they will be able to sustain that performance. If you are looking for an alternative should those two both stumble, the two likeliest places to look would be Rachel and the 3yo colt division. Rachel showed extraordinary ability last year, and now looks to be returning to form in ways that could mean that in the last half of the year she will hit a peak superior to anything she showed last year. That would be impressive. The 3yo colt division, by definition, always produces one or two male performers by the end of summer, who if they step up and defeat older open company deserve serious consideration.

We are speaking of no more than half a dozen horses who either have already presented themselves as outstanding racehorses or who will do so by the time the year is over. Each of them should be campaigned to best showcase their ability in the races that matter most. When that happens, I think the awards take care of themselves, and everybody wins. I thought we had a tremendous year of racing last year, and I have been remarkably pleased with this year's racing, as well. That people can be disappointed by the racing that they have witnessed the last year and a half always amazes me.

[Man o' Taz]

I love Lucky, but if he's ever on the same track with Rail Trip ... He will NOT finish ahead of him ... You continue to sell Rail Trip short ... But in time you'll understand just how good he truly is Taz ...

And I know you still care about HOY, but I could care less if Zenny wins it ... My focus is staying undefeated and closing out her career with another Classic win ...

I suspect that's Shirreffs and the Moss' goal also ... Not HOY

Sell Rail Trip short?

I offered some what ifs...:biggrin1:

I have not been selling Rail Trip short at all.

I am the one who when Rick suggested that Quality Road was the only quality older horse responded that he was forgetting about Rail Trip, I was the one who was agreeing wholeheartedly with The Tin Man (you) when you suggested that Rail Trip, not Quality Road repesented the biggest threat to Zenyatta winning the Breeders Cup Classic again, though I was also the one who suggested that Zenyatta should take on Rail Trip in the HGC because I felt that she could beat him... :rolleyes:

I have never sold Rail Trip short. I just happen to believe that Zenyatta is better. I would think that this was something that we were in agreement on, but perhaps not...;)

[The Tin Man]

Sell Rail Trip short?

I offered some what ifs...:biggrin1:

I have not been selling Rail Trip short at all.

I am the one who when Rick suggested that Quality Road was the only quality older horse responded that he was forgetting about Rail Trip, I was the one who was agreeing wholeheartedly with The Tin Man when he suggested that Rail Trip, not Quality Road repesented the biggest threat to Zenyatta winning the Breeders Cup Classic again, though I was also the one who suggested that Zenyatta should take on Rail Trip in the HGC because I felt that she could beat him... :rolleyes:

I have never sold Rail Trip short. I just happen to believe that Zenyatta is better. I would think that this was something that we were in agreement on, but perhaps not...;)

If you think Lucky would beat Rail Trip ... You sell Rail Trip short ... NO way I see that happening ...

[Spahny]

I've wanted to put up HR's post for a while now but always talked myself out of it.

Zenyatta's weight loss after the Arkansas trip helps to explain her lighter training regimine as well as shedding a little light on the decision not to ship again to Churchill. Where she is now after having to work to catch St Trinians is still a question mark. Meanwhile everybody's newest west coast darling Rail Trip just tuned up with a 1:17 6f work at Santa Anita that is difficult to fathom with his target race just a couple weeks out. Team Rachel lost their minds this winter for a while and seem to be on track again but just as soon as you think you have it lined up in your sights in this game the target moves on you again. All of this is what holds my interest in the game. I see very few races, if any, that happen with all entrants coming in on equal footing. I kind of like it that way. No complaints.

[The Tin Man]

Sell Rail Trip short?

I offered some what ifs...:biggrin1:

I have not been selling Rail Trip short at all.

I am the one who when Rick suggested that Quality Road was the only quality older horse responded that he was forgetting about Rail Trip, I was the one who was agreeing wholeheartedly with The Tin Man when he suggested that Rail Trip, not Quality Road repesented the biggest threat to Zenyatta winning the Breeders Cup Classic again, though I was also the one who suggested that Zenyatta should take on Rail Trip in the HGC because I felt that she could beat him... :rolleyes:

I have never sold Rail Trip short. I just happen to believe that Zenyatta is better. I would think that this was something that we were in agreement on, but perhaps not...;)


As far as Zenny beating Rail Trip ... I honestly don't know. Because of his style and endurance, it's really a toss up to me. As it stands today, were the Classic being held today ... I'd be putting both Rail Trip AND Zenny at the top of my trifecta ... Just those two ... I wouldn't single her like I did last year ... I'm truly not sure who would win between them(Because of his style being such a threat to hers), so I'd put them both.

I would WANT Zenny to win and retire undefeated though.

Obviously based on career, Zenny is by far the more accomplished horse. But that doesn't mean he couldn't beat her now ... Because I most certainly think he could. He scarfes the heck out of me when it comes to her.

I think she would probably find a way to win, but they'd better run her mo more than 5 or 6 off of him tops ... And I wouldn't be shocked even a tiny little bit if he won. So I'd use them both up top ... It's a toss up to me.

But certainly she's accomplished far more in her career and MAY still be the best horse in training even as I type.

It's kind of like Albert Pujols may struggle mightily hitting against curveball pitchers, yet may dominate a fastball pitcher ... It doesn't mean the curveball pitcher is better ... It just means it's a style thay may be playing to his weakness ... That's how Railt Trip is to Zenyatta IMHO ... The question is ... can she still overcome it? I'm not sure, so I'll use them both.

[The Tin Man]

I've wanted to put up HR's post for a while now but always talked myself out of it.

Zenyatta's weight loss after the Arkansas trip helps to explain her lighter training regimine as well as shedding a little light on the decision not to ship again to Churchill. Where she is now after having to work to catch St Trinians is still a question mark. Meanwhile everybody's newest west coast darling Rail Trip just tuned up with a 1:17 6f work at Santa Anita that is difficult to fathom with his target race just a couple weeks out. Team Rachel lost their minds this winter for a while and seem to be on track again but just as soon as you think you have it lined up in your sights in this game the target moves on you again. All of this is what holds my interest in the game. I see very few races, if any, that happen with all entrants coming in on equal footing. I kind of like it that way. No complaints.

Just so you know Spahny ... I've been following Rail Trip EXTREMELY closely since the day after his FIRST race ... My being enamored with him is far from new. It was evident to me in his first race that he had incredible potential. :rockon:

[Man o' Taz]

MoT, I don't think about horses and horse racing the way you do.

You speak of this stuff as though the goal were to win an election, and that's how you make your decisions.

I think of this as a sport, where you try to do the right thing with your horse; and at the end of the year, there is a separate banquet that recognizes performance. The banquet is secondary to the sport, not the reason for the sport.

I think Zenyatta faces a huge challenge this year, because she is six years old and campaigned through the fall to the biggest race of the year last year, then never really left training going into this year. Trying to set up a campaign that will allow her to peak again in the fall at her age is extremely difficult.

I think Quality Road faces a very different challenge, trying to sustain soundness when he has a very large body that runs very fast on very small feet. Those two seem the clear top horses to have performed thus far this year; and for me, that means that we still have a long way to go before we begin deciding who was the best horse to race this year.

If either one of those horses sustains performance at the level that they have established for the rest of the year, it will be difficult to look past them to anyone else. But both of them have serious question marks as to the question of whether they will be able to sustain that performance. If you are looking for an alternative should those two both stumble, the two likeliest places to look would be Rachel and the 3yo colt division. Rachel showed extraordinary ability last year, and now looks to be returning to form in ways that could mean that in the last half of the year she will hit a peak superior to anything she showed last year. That would be impressive. The 3yo colt division, by definition, always produces one or two male performers by the end of summer, who if they step up and defeat older open company deserve serious consideration.

We are speaking of no more than half a dozen horses who either have already presented themselves as outstanding racehorses or who will do so by the time the year is over.

[I have suggested there are maybe 3 horses that can win HOTY...and I could add Rail Trip, though I really think that is a long shot given that he will likely only have 3 Grade I wins if he were to win out]

Each of them should be campaigned to best showcase their ability in the races that matter most. When that happens, I think the awards take care of themselves, and everybody wins. I thought we had a tremendous year of racing last year, and I have been remarkably pleased with this year's racing, as well. That people can be disappointed by the racing that they have witnessed the last year and a half always amazes me.

Well, the race for HOTY is an election of sorts...which requires a campaign...no doubt about that...especially when you put it in the hands of actual voters...

And, of course we have a long way to go...who did not state that...you try and act like the wise old codger who is sitting in his tower on high and exorting we the racing plebians with your wisdom...and thought that none of us take into account...or would even come close to having entered our frame of mind... :doh:

Because we have a long way to go, I think that Zenyatta could take on another tough race in a year...and you seem to be suggesting that for a horse her age to do that is too much...and I would point you to horses like Better Talk Now and Evening Attire who raced plenty of times each year in tough races...now they did not win every one...but you would have to concede they did not have the talent of Zenyatta either.

Do you really see Zenyatta's effort in the Vanity as less than a needed sharpening for form since her 8 week layoff as Mike Smith stated? I thought she ran beautifully, and despite the dehydration issue that she had, she had recovered well -- and I think I have been perfectly reasonable in my support for her not racing outside the state of CA.

Now, you want to go on about Zenyatta's age as a six year old, but you have to take into account that Zenyatta's three year old season where she was really tested did not occur until her 5 year old season. So, I understand physically that she is indeed a six year old, but you have to honestly say she has not been stressed or really pushed the way many of the other horses she has been competing against have been. I mean she usually had been rested quite a long time between races...which is fine...she only had 5 of them last year after all....and only one race where she was really tested...

And if she was in as bad a shape as you seem to suggest that she is in...then they should have retired her...

I am talking one additional race which is 4 months from the BC Classic...its not like I am asking her to run in the Arc before the Breeders Cup (though as you know I would have preferred that as a replacement for her run in the BC this year... :becky:)

I was not disappointed by the racing I have seen in any of the past years. If I were disappointed I would likely not follow the sport as closely as I do.

[Spahny]

Just so you know Spahny ... I've been following Rail Trip EXTREMELY closely since the day after his FIRST race ... My being enamored with him is far from new. It was evident to me in his first race that he had incredible potential. :rockon:
Not many of us out west missed Rail Trip early in his career. I like him as well.

He seems to have become the Z detractor squad's new favorite this year. Of course he's never shipped out of the state and this year he has a nice rivalry going with Sangaree but nevermind about that. I only wished to point out that latest work as an example of how hard it is to keep them all on top of their game, not that I am assuming there is anything actually wrong with him. As far as I know he is fine. I'm not a person that believes in a vote at the end of the year to make perfect sense out of a game that is never status quo. And no, I didn't have any problem with last year's results. But I guarantee you that those who loved last year's results will be calling for the heads of voters if displeased by this year's tabulations.

[Man o' Taz]

Not many of us out west missed Rail Trip early in his career. I like him as well.

He seems to have become the Z detractor squad's new favorite this year. Of course he's never shipped out of the state and this year he has a nice rivalry going with Sangaree but nevermind about that. I only wished to point out that latest work as an example of how hard it is to keep them all on top of their game, not that I am assuming there is anything actually wrong with him. As far as I know he is fine. I'm not a person that believes in a vote at the end of the year to make perfect sense out of a game that is never status quo. And no, I didn't have any problem with last year's results. But I guarantee you that those who loved last year's results will be calling for the heads of voters if displeased by this year's tabulations.

I loved last year's results and I will regret it if Zenyatta does not win this year, but I will not be calling for anyone's head having reconciled myself to the reality that this is a popularity contest...and nothing more. :becky:

[Slewbopper]

Come on Shirrefs....grow a pair. State that Zen's next race will be the Ruffian Handicap at the Spa on August 1. It seems like this race is Rachel's next intention. Force the biggest hedger in the game to pony up or forever be labeled a dodger of the nth degree. Zen will get 129. Rachel 124 or 125.

To me it makes total sense since Zen's peeps are so concerned about never losing. Zen really does not like Delmar and if she were to run in the Hirsch again, I would take a serious stand against her if St. Trinians is also in the gate.

Morning Line.....

Zenyatta 129................4/5
Rachel Alexandra 124......7/5

[The Tin Man]

Come on Shirrefs....grow a pair. State that Zen's next race will be the Ruffian Handicap at the Spa on August 1. It seems like this race is Rachel's next intention. Force the biggest hedger in the game to pony up or forever be labeled a dodger of the nth degree. Zen will get 129. Rachel 124 or 125.

To me it makes total sense since Zen's peeps are so concerned about never losing. Zen really does not like Delmar and if she were to run in the Hirsch again, I would take a serious stand against her if St. Trinians is also in the gate.

Morning Line.....

Zenyatta 129................4/5
Rachel Alexandra 124......7/5

Bopper ... I'd be totally for Shirreffs announcing Zenyatta as heading to the Ruffian too to call Jackson out ... The only problem is that Jackson would wait until the last second(as usual) to announce where Rachel is going and Zenny would have already had to have shipped in just in case ... So she'd be stuck in The Ruffian running against the Life At Tens of the world ...

I just wonder if that were to happen ... and Jackson then came out with whatever excuses he concocted ... If the public would buy it again or would they really FINALLY see Jackson for what he is? ... or would he get a free pass ... benefit of the doubt as usual?

[Slewbopper]

Bopper ... I'd be totally for Shirreffs announcing Zenyatta as heading to the Ruffian too to call Jackson out ... The only problem is that Jackson would wait until the last second(as usual) to announce where Rachel is going and Zenny would have already had to have shipped in just in case ... So she'd be stuck in The Ruffian running against the Life At Tens of the world ...

I just wonder if that were to happen ... and Jackson then came out with whatever excuses he concocted ... If the public would buy it again or would they really FINALLY see Jackson for what he is? ... or would he get a free pass ... benefit of the doubt as usual?

TM...it is a great opportunity for 'nadless Shirreffs to force the Grand Hedger's hand. Also think about this....the Whitney is the next Saturday (7th). He could just say that Zen will ship to the Spa with either the Ruffian or the Whitney as her target and state he will wait for the weights for the two races..

[GinTalking]

On to Plan B. :)

[luvsgeldings]

did anyone else hear dottie shirreffs on roger steins radio show this morning? first, let me say she is the most gracious and classy lady - i admire her a ton - she mentioned that the beldame could be a possibility for zenyatta this year - she also said they nominated zen to the beldame last year hoping to meet rachel there - oh and zen raised a lot of money for the L A zoo animals recently and will be hosting a 'breakfast with zenyatta' next weekend for the people who donated - dottie said john will sometimes spend a couple of hours just watching zen during the day - he loves looking at her - - she also mentioned that last years BC classic was the last horse race that bobby frankel ever watched - she got emotional talking about bobby and said many wonderful things about him too.

[Ezariah]

Does anyone know the date of the Beldame this year? Thanks in advance!

[luvsgeldings]

ezariah, i guess that's part of the problem according to dottie - NY has changed the dates for races this year.

[islandgirl45]

ezariah, i guess that's part of the problem according to dottie - NY has changed the dates for races this year.

I don't think it's been scheduled yet, has it? I guess NYRA's financial problems were such they didn't know if there was going to be a fall racing season.

[WestCoast]

Just an update: Went and watched her gallop this morning. She looks phenomenal, as always.

:becky:

[weatherbird]

Does anyone know the date of the Beldame this year? Thanks in advance!
I'm certain it will be October 2nd. Five weeks after the Personal Ensign and five weeks prior to BC Day

[Secretariat Forever]

Just an update: Went and watched her gallop this morning. She looks phenomenal, as always.

:becky:


good to hear! thanks for updating us!



Zenyatta's FB site says her next start is at Del Mar...does this person know something we don't, I thought it wasn't official?

[speckledpuppy]

good to hear! thanks for updating us!



Zenyatta's FB site says her next start is at Del Mar...does this person know something we don't, I thought it wasn't official?

It would be nice to know for sure what her schedule will be the next few months. However, I am looking forward to another St. Trinians vs. Zenyatta match race the last one was a thriller for sure.

[islandgirl45]

Just an update: Went and watched her gallop this morning. She looks phenomenal, as always.

:becky:


When is she next scheduled to work, do you know? Mike Smith said she needed the last race, so I'm interested to see her next 6 furlong work.

[Citation07]

What are the odds of a member of the general public getting in to watch gallops the morning of the Gold Cup? I'm driving to LA on Friday evening and just staying the night to go to Hollywood Park the next day and I was interested in possibly getting to see the morning workouts (and Z, obviously).:)

[The Tin Man]

What are the odds of a member of the general public getting in to watch gallops the morning of the Gold Cup? I'm driving to LA on Friday evening and just staying the night to go to Hollywood Park the next day and I was interested in possibly getting to see the morning workouts (and Z, obviously).:)


Tell Rail Trip good luck for me ... And give Tres Borrachos a hug too ... I love that guy! :becky:

[The Tin Man]

He'd get a pass, because most aren't wielding axes. Every call that has been made on Rachel since Jackson has owned her has been perfectly logical.

I'm sure he would ... He's gotten a pass on every move thus far ... I'm sure that will never change.

As far as every move he has made being logical ... Obviously SOS ... We've always disagreed on that and always will. There's NO sense in you and I debating that, as we will NEVER change our points of view on Jackson. So we'll just avoid discussing our very different feelings on Jackson and be this way instead ... :hippie:

[WestCoast]

When is she next scheduled to work, do you know? Mike Smith said she needed the last race, so I'm interested to see her next 6 furlong work.

Tomorrow. :)



What are the odds of a member of the general public getting in to watch gallops the morning of the Gold Cup? I'm driving to LA on Friday evening and just staying the night to go to Hollywood Park the next day and I was interested in possibly getting to see the morning workouts (and Z, obviously).:)

I wouldn't count on sneaking in. HP security has been really curmudgeony this year. Do you know anyone who can leave you a pass?

[Secretariat Forever]

He'd get a pass, because most aren't wielding axes. Every call that has been made on Rachel since Jackson has owned her has been perfectly logical.


what's logical about skipping the Ruffian for the Lady's Secret at Monmouth?

[luvsgeldings]

every sunday morning at hollywood (during their meet), they have this railbird club - its free and open to everyone - from 7:30 to 9:30am - you watch the horses working on the track - rich perloff from tvg hosts - sometimes they have a guest speaker - its at the finish line cafe in the grandstand - probably the best shot to see zen in the morning for those of us not connected to anyone in racing. i have heard she comes out after 9am.

[Citation07]

Thanks for the responses, WestCoast and luvs. Unfortunately, I'm only going to be around Saturday morning and I don't really know anyone, so it looks like I won't get in. Too bad, but I still have a great day of racing to look forward to. :)

Getting away from my digression, was Zenyatta supposed to work this morning?

[WestCoast]

Getting away from my digression, was Zenyatta supposed to work this morning?

She did. 5 furlongs with a stablemate whose name I can't remember, but not one of her usual punching bags :)... I heard she went a minute and change, but I don't think the official time is up yet.

She looked lovely, if I do say so myself.

[Majella from Ireland]

The time was 1.01:20. You are so lucky to be able to watch her work! :)

[islandgirl45]

The time was 1.01:20. You are so lucky to be able to watch her work! :)

Does the "h" in the notes about her workout mean "handily?"

Also, some workouts say "hg." What does that signify?

[second_glance]

Does the "h" in the notes about her workout mean "handily?"

Also, some workouts say "hg." What does that signify?

h = handily; hg = handily from the gate

[Diver52]

Does the "h" in the notes about her workout mean "handily?"

Also, some workouts say "hg." What does that signify?
"Handily from gate." "Handily" in southern California means "more effort than a breeze," which is the opposite from eastern practice.

[WestCoast]

Kind of surprised she got the H. Mike was barely moving, but I guess he wasn't perfectly still, either. [shrug]

[WestCoast]

The time was 1.01:20. You are so lucky to be able to watch her work! :)

I know... I really am. I will miss it when I move to Del Mar and she doesn't.

[ZJ]

Zenyatta shows her new restraint in work
http://drf.com/news/article/114503.html

[Horse's Rear]

That doesn't sound good.

[ZJ]

That doesn't sound good.


Nope. Sounds like just the sort of thing that can get her beat.

[Citation07]

Sounds like the sort of thing that's going to give me a heart attack, that's what it sounds like. Interesting. Wonder what the fractions of the work were...

[islandgirl45]

Nope. Sounds like just the sort of thing that can get her beat.

It sounds like Mike Smith is going to have to push her to start her run earlier.

This comment from Jerry Moss is interesting to me:

The Clement Hirsch "is a mile and a sixteenth, and this year we've been so solid at a mile and an eighth," Moss said. "What I think is not that important. The coach is the coach. We want to get her as good as we can for the Breeders' Cup.I wonder if 1-1/16 miles isn't a bit short for Zen as well.

[Thoroughbred Info]

For anyone who is interested in a ZENYATTA BOBBLEHEAD, there is a contest at www.thoroughbredinfo.com (http://www.thoroughbredinfo.com) to win one.

There will be a random drawing on July 31 to select the winner from among Thoroughbred Info's Facebook fans (to become a fan, click the "Like" button on the Facebook page). No cost to enter, although the winner must be a U.S. resident for prize shipping purposes.

Good luck!

[forgotten]

Jerry Moss attended Monday's workout and said he will defer largely to Shirreffs in making a decision on Zenyatta's next race. This year, Zenyatta has won three stakes at 1 1/8 miles. A defense of her win in the Breeders' Cup Classic at Churchill Downs in November is a long-term goal, Moss emphasized.
The Clement Hirsch "is a mile and a sixteenth, and this year we've been so solid at a mile and an eighth," Moss said. "What I think is not that important. The coach is the coach. We want to get her as good as we can for the Breeders' Cup.

Moss is like the Anti-Jackson....it sure makes it easier to be a fan of the horse...

[GinTalking]

Moss is like the Anti-Jackson....it sure makes it easier to be a fan of the horse...

Oh, come now. Must there always be a dig etched into every post. You couldn't have just pasted the quote and left it at that.

What I got out of it was that he wasn't that keen on going back in distance to 8.5f ... but like the good owner that he is, he will defer to his trainer. Wow, that makes him one of about a few thousand people ... just not quite like a few others who like to have a say in the horse's schedule.

Also, Moss employs a racing manager (who presumably sleeps in the same bed as the trainer) so the situations aren't quite the same. Jackson is his own racing manager so he has more to say. Apparently Arnold Zetcher doesn't mind speaking his own mind, nor do the Wygods.

[forgotten]

Oh, come now. Must there always be a dig etched into every post. You couldn't have just pasted the quote and left it at that.

What I got out of it was that he wasn't that keen on going back in distance to 8.5f ... but like the good owner that he is, he will defer to his trainer. Wow, that makes him one of about a few thousand people ... just not quite like a few others who like to have a say in the horse's schedule.

Also, Moss employs a racing manager (who presumably sleeps in the same bed as the trainer) so the situations aren't quite the same. Jackson is his own racing manager so he has more to say. Apparently Arnold Zetcher doesn't mind speaking his own mind, nor do the Wygods.
Pardon me for not reading my posting rules prior to stating my opinion.....

So far Moss's ability to let his trainer train has worked out pretty well for him and his horse. She appears to have come back just as good as last year and, while its not the most exciting schedule, has managed to win what she has in years before. Maybe, just maybe these connections are doing something right????

I'm sorry but, all things being equal, it really does make it easier to be a fan of this team.

[The Tin Man]

What I got out of it was that he wasn't that keen on going back in distance to 8.5f ... but like the good owner that he is, he will defer to his trainer. Wow, that makes him one of about a few thousand people ... just not quite like a few others who like to have a say in the horse's schedule.


Gin ... With all due respect ... If Jackson deferred to his trainer Rachel would have been running in The Apple Blossom against Zenyatta this year.

After The New Orleans Ladies, Assmussen said after the race that Rachel came back in great shape, was eating up well and was on target to be shipping out to Oaklawn ...

Then Jackson put the clamps down on him and gag ordered BOTH Assmussen and Borel ...

If you think Jackson just steps back and lets his trainer train and make the decisions on what the horse does, you are sorely mistaken.

If you disagree with what I'm saying Assmussen was saying after The New Orleans Ladies, then go back and read the quotes from the first day or two after the race and you'll see my recollection is nearly verbatim.

There are very few owners that step on their trainers toes as much as Jackson does Assmussen's.

[Secretariat Forever]

I don't like that he's letting her wait longer to make her move. That's going to get her beat especially if she does that against males.

:confused:


Otherwise, sounds like it was a good work! Is there a video anywhere?

[luvsgeldings]

forgotten, i could not agree with you more!! love everything about zen's team - her 'coach', owners, jock - its a true pleasure rooting for her and her people - - by the way, the zenyatta bobble's are also being sold in the hollywood park gift store - 15 bucks in the store or $25 with shipping if you need it mailed - part of the proceeds will be donated to CARMA (a horse retirement charity in calif) - you can call 310-330-7165 or email giftshop@hollywoodpark.com - they are also selling the vanity program - - yeah i hope zen isn't getting too smart for her own good - she may be used to where the wire is here in calif, but what about when she gets to an unfamiliar track - i hope mike keeps this in mind especially at churchill. but no matter what, in zen i trust!!

[Spahny]

They have their hands full keeping her on top of her game through the summer and in to the fall championships at Churchill. I find no fault with John Shirreffs handling of this great mare. If he fails it won't be for lack of effort. I would put all of my trust in him too, were I to be so lucky as to own a horse this great.

It seems to me they are relying on Zenyatta to lead them home now, in the sense that she is a full professional at this point and that she knows what she is doing and understands every phase of her task. Their only job is to keep her happy and comfortable. Carl Nafzger wrote that 'you let the horse take you'. I like that quote; so devoid of ego. We'll see how it works out this time. It would be great fun if it does.

[speckledpuppy]

I don't like that he's letting her wait longer to make her move. That's going to get her beat especially if she does that against males.

:confused:



Otherwise, sounds like it was a good work! Is there a video anywhere?

I think that is a valid point. Males will be much tougher to catch with that late move. I am hoping they plan on keeping her closer in the Classic. They can't expect her to make up 10 lengths on Quality Road in stretch.

[Horse's Rear]

One of the things that strikes me as unpromising is that her last start was the second time in her career that she wound up in a position where she had to be all out to get to the wire first.

The other time was last year in the Hirsch. Coming out of that race, her reaction in training was almost exactly opposite of what Smith describes here.


Since the Hirsch, Zenyatta has had three workouts, including a six-furlong breeze in 1:13.40 at Hollywood Park on Sept. 18. The workout left jockey Mike Smith and Shirreffs impressed. "The last time he worked her, [Smith] said she showed a lot of acceleration," Shirreffs said. "She got to her workmate in three jumps."
http://www.drf.com/drfNewsArticle.do?NID=107510&subs=0&arc=1


Her starts after that, in the Lady's Secret and BC Classic, were her most dominant races of the year. It certainly looked like the Hirsch had served as a wake up call mentally. This sounds like Smith is trying to put a positive spin on her going back to the style she was handicapping herself with earlier in the year last year.

[The Tin Man]

I think that is a valid point. Males will be much tougher to catch with that late move. I am hoping they plan on keeping her closer in the Classic. They can't expect her to make up 10 lengths on Quality Road in stretch.

Dray ... You're focusing on the wrong horse ... It'll be Rail Trip she will need to stay within 5 lengths of and Rail Trip who she will be trying to catch on the wire ... QR will be fighting the others for 3rd ... You'll see :becky:

[islandgirl45]

Dray ... You're focusing on the wrong horse ... It'll be Rail Trip she will need to stay within 5 lengths of and Rail Trip who she will be trying to catch on the wire ... QR will be fighting the others for 3rd ... You'll see :becky:

TTM, is Draynay now posting as speckledpuppy? How do you know for sure?

[islandgirl45]

One of the things that strikes me as unpromising is that her last start was the second time in her career that she wound up in a position where she had to be all out to get to the wire first.

The other time was last year in the Hirsch. Coming out of that race, her reaction in training was almost exactly opposite of what Smith describes here.


http://www.drf.com/drfNewsArticle.do?NID=107510&subs=0&arc=1


Her starts after that, in the Lady's Secret and BC Classic, were her most dominant races of the year. It certainly looked like the Hirsch had served as a wake up call mentally. This sounds like Smith is trying to put a positive spin on her going back to the style she was handicapping herself with earlier in the year last year.

Well, he's driving. She's not running riderless. Isn't it up to Mike to hustle her along a bit to keep from falling too far back?

[Horse's Rear]

They are not machines. It is not a matter of stepping on the accelerator. Especially at the top level, but really at every level, this sport--like all others--makes fierce demands on the athlete mentally. Some horses are naturally more competitive than others; honing that competitive edge is an important feature of their success. Keeping that edge sharp once they peak becomes more demanding over time. Last year, Zenyatta began the year like a horse who was bored and no longer interested in performing the same set of tasks. The Hirsch woke her up, and she changed her attitude dramatically the last 90 days of the season. This sounds like she's getting bored and losing interest. That's not a good sign in a horse her age.

[JT Dancer]

One of the things that strikes me as unpromising is that her last start was the second time in her career that she wound up in a position where she had to be all out to get to the wire first.

I don't think she was all out in her last start; she never pinned her ears, she was just playing all through the stretch. Right when she crossed the wire, the ears shot forward, and she was cantering. Unless Z is the rare horse who does not show the classic "all out" signs, she hasn't been all out.

That said, I do think she is bored; she seems to want some real competition and barring actually having super horses to race against, she is just doing the bare minimum of running to get to the wire first.

[Horsebagger]

They are not machines. It is not a matter of stepping on the accelerator. Especially at the top level, but really at every level, this sport--like all others--makes fierce demands on the athlete mentally. Some horses are naturally more competitive than others; honing that competitive edge is an important feature of their success. Keeping that edge sharp once they peak becomes more demanding over time. Last year, Zenyatta began the year like a horse who was bored and no longer interested in performing the same set of tasks. The Hirsch woke her up, and she changed her attitude dramatically the last 90 days of the season. This sounds like she's getting bored and losing interest. That's not a good sign in a horse her age.


This was my first reaction also. But why did Smith decide to throw this out there publicly? CYA?

[islandgirl45]

They are not machines. It is not a matter of stepping on the accelerator. Especially at the top level, but really at every level, this sport--like all others--makes fierce demands on the athlete mentally. Some horses are naturally more competitive than others; honing that competitive edge is an important feature of their success. Keeping that edge sharp once they peak becomes more demanding over time. Last year, Zenyatta began the year like a horse who was bored and no longer interested in performing the same set of tasks. The Hirsch woke her up, and she changed her attitude dramatically the last 90 days of the season. This sounds like she's getting bored and losing interest. That's not a good sign in a horse her age.

Really? You don't just turn the key and drive?:rolleyes:
I assumed jockeys play a role in winning horse races. Perhaps I was mistaken.

I'm curious about this statement as fact...."Last year, Zenyatta began the year like a horse who was bored and no longer interested in performing the same set of tasks."

Where did you pick up this idea? Are you inferring you know this because you're close to Zenyatta's connections? I'm asking because I haven't read anything like that.

[Horse's Rear]

Go back and look at her works early in the year last year before her first race. They commented at the time that she was slower responding and getting into gear than she had been. As they get older, horses tend to "cheat" on you in training; and Shirreffs said that he was trying some things to get her sparked. You can see it pretty easily in that well-publicized helmet cam where Smith moves her out for her run and has to smooch at her for about a sixteenth before she begins to put it in gear. In her first start back, in the Milady, he runs her up inside of Life is Sweet earlier than he usually pulls the trigger, and uses that one starting her move to wind up Zenyatta. But all through the year until the Hirsch, you can see that she is loafing for him. After the Hirsch, it's like a light went on, both in the way Smith and Shirreffs describe her morning work and the way she raced in the afternoon.


Unless Z is the rare horse who does not show the classic "all out" signs, she hasn't been all out.
I haven't watched the replay, but watching the Vanity in real time, I thought she was all out inside the sixteenth pole. I know she was all out in the Hirsch last year.

[Banshee Breeze]

Jerry Moss attended Monday's workout and said he will defer largely to Shirreffs in making a decision on Zenyatta's next race. This year, Zenyatta has won three stakes at 1 1/8 miles. A defense of her win in the Breeders' Cup Classic at Churchill Downs in November is a long-term goal, Moss emphasized.
The Clement Hirsch "is a mile and a sixteenth, and this year we've been so solid at a mile and an eighth," Moss said. "What I think is not that important. The coach is the coach. We want to get her as good as we can for the Breeders' Cup.

Moss is like the Anti-Jackson....it sure makes it easier to be a fan of the horse...

Yes, it is so easy to be a fan of a horse that stays in one state for the majority of its races and run in the same races year after year with the same mundane fields.
I love this mare but I am truely disappointed in the route they are taking her this year. Again, she will end up losing the HOY title and deservedly so.

[Banshee Breeze]

Go back and look at her works early in the year last year before her first race. They commented at the time that she was slower responding and getting into gear than she had been. As they get older, horses tend to "cheat" on you in training; and Shirreffs said that he was trying some things to get her sparked. You can see it pretty easily in that well-publicized helmet cam where Smith moves her out for her run and has to smooch at her for about a sixteenth before she begins to put it in gear. In her first start back, in the Milady, he runs her up inside of Life is Sweet earlier than he usually pulls the trigger, and uses that one starting her move to wind up Zenyatta. But all through the year until the Hirsch, you can see that she is loafing for him. After the Hirsch, it's like a light went on, both in the way Smith and Shirreffs describe her morning work and the way she raced in the afternoon.


I haven't watched the replay, but watching the Vanity in real time, I thought she was all out inside the sixteenth pole. I know she was all out in the Hirsch last year.

Her "all out" still looks effortlessly. That's where she fools us. She was all out and almost got beat by a tiny horse.

[islandgirl45]

Go back and look at her works early in the year last year before her first race. They commented at the time that she was slower responding and getting into gear than she had been. As they get older, horses tend to "cheat" on you in training; and Shirreffs said that he was trying some things to get her sparked. You can see it pretty easily in that well-publicized helmet cam where Smith moves her out for her run and has to smooch at her for about a sixteenth before she begins to put it in gear. In her first start back, in the Milady, he runs her up inside of Life is Sweet earlier than he usually pulls the trigger, and uses that one starting her move to wind up Zenyatta. But all through the year until the Hirsch, you can see that she is loafing for him. After the Hirsch, it's like a light went on, both in the way Smith and Shirreffs describe her morning work and the way she raced in the afternoon.


I haven't watched the replay, but watching the Vanity in real time, I thought she was all out inside the sixteenth pole. I know she was all out in the Hirsch last year.

In the Milady he tried to sneak by LIS and Gomez along the rail to save ground and Gomez cut him off, making him check off the heels of LIS and go outside. That looked like tactical race riding to me, rather than "OMG, I have to wake Zenyatta up." Smith typically doesn't start cranking her up until about the final turn anyway. In the Clement Hirsch he waited even later and that nearly backfired on him, so in the next race he kept her closer to the pace. I get that you want your horse to be motivated, but it's up to the jockeys to decide tactics.

Also, I don't think Zenyatta has ever been a consistently hard charging workout horse like say, Jackson Bend. It's no secret that her exercise rider and jockey say she needs a workout target, preferably one that can provide some pace.

[JT Dancer]

Her "all out" still looks effortlessly. That's where she fools us. She was all out and almost got beat by a tiny horse.

I guess we can agree to disagree. I don't think she has ever been "all out" in the traditional sense of the term. I was at the Vanity and could see her loafing along down the length of the stretch.

She is not coming back breathing heavy and covered in sweat. She looks and acts like she could go again. Just because it was close doesn't mean she was in danger of losing; I firmly believe she knew just where she was in the Vanity and what she needed to do to get to the wire.

[EquineAnne]

Oh, come now. Must there always be a dig etched into every post. You couldn't have just pasted the quote and left it at that.



And you could have let it go by but didn't. :nono:

[islandgirl45]

I guess we can agree to disagree. I don't think she has ever been "all out" in the traditional sense of the term. I was at the Vanity and could see her loafing along down the length of the stretch.

She is not coming back breathing heavy and covered in sweat. She looks and acts like she could go again. Just because it was close doesn't mean she was in danger of losing; I firmly believe she knew just where she was in the Vanity and what she needed to do to get to the wire.

I think it was Faith, or perhaps another poster, who saw her after the race and said she wasn't even blowing. I remember she did her prance in the winner's circle and even picked up one of her back feet to threaten a little cowkick to someone who walked too closely behind her. The same person who saw both Zenyatta and St Trinians after the race said St Trinians looked tired.

Jay Hovdey from DRF also wrote of St Trinians..."Her front legs going all directions, the British mare gave as much as you can give to a race and still be upright at the end. Standing there afterwards, being unsaddled in the backwash of the Zenyatta din, she was spent, dizzy and noble. I hope she knew some of that noise was for her."

[Proud Appeal]

I think that is a valid point. Rachel will be much tougher to catch with that late move. I am hoping they plan on keeping her closer in the Classic. They can't expect her to make up 10 lengths on Rachel Alexandra in stretch.

Edited that for you :)

[drjohnh]

I don't think she was all out in her last start; she never pinned her ears, she was just playing all through the stretch. Right when she crossed the wire, the ears shot forward, and she was cantering. Unless Z is the rare horse who does not show the classic "all out" signs, she hasn't been all out.

That said, I do think she is bored; she seems to want some real competition and barring actually having super horses to race against, she is just doing the bare minimum of running to get to the wire first.

i agree with this, she sure didn't look all out in her last race but i don't think her races are boring her..i think she just enjoys toying with whoever is the leader in the stretch. maybe they need to spice up her works somehow but i wonder if getting after her early will just piss her off

off subject but is there a darn spell check on this forum?

[Horse's Rear]

In the Milady he tried to sneak by LIS and Gomez along the rail to save ground and Gomez cut him off, making him check off the heels of LIS and go outside. That looked like tactical race riding to me, rather than "OMG, I have to wake Zenyatta up." Smith typically doesn't start cranking her up until about the final turn anyway. In the Clement Hirsch he waited even later and that nearly backfired on him, so in the next race he kept her closer to the pace. I get that you want your horse to be motivated, but it's up to the jockeys to decide tactics.

We may just see things differently, and if so, I would suggest we should leave it at that. But after reading your post, I thought I owed it to you to go back and watch those races again. It was a pleasure, and I thank you for sending me back to them. Let me make a few comments and a suggestion.

I don't think Gomez ever thought that it would be a good idea to try to get an edge on his stablemate by cutting her off as she started her move. I think you are absolutely right that Smith doesn't ask for run that early. If you would look at her works and read the comments made about them at the time, you will have a context in which to watch these races, I believe, in which one can see Shirreffs working to try and offset a tendency she has to be a bit lazy. I think the early feint on the inside in the Milady was tactical to that end: Smith does not like to run inside; Zenyatta does her best running on the outside; and she seldom makes her run before midway on the turn. In her workouts, the pattern has always been to keep her covered up behind a workmate, and move her outside so that the open lane is a cue to run. You can see in her early 2009 works that she is responding leisurely to that cue. In the Milady, Smith feints inside Life is Sweet early, then checks and is able to start his serious move at the usual time. I think he used the feint-and-check to get her aggressive and on the bit.

My suggestion is this: watch the Milady, followed by the Hirsch, followed by the Lady's Secret, from last year. All three are races in which Life is Sweet is in the field, and they offer a guide to changes in Zenyatta's mental attitude. In the Milady, the early inside feint triggers a serious rally that commences inside the 3f pole. In the Hirsch, Smith asks her to pick it up approaching that pole and she is slow to respond. He is asking her on the turn and she really doesn't give him run until approaching the quarter pole. Inside the eighth pole she has to drop down on her belly and get after it to get there in time. Then watch the Lady's Secret. She is much more competitive from the gate. She breaks last, and entirely on her own is up with Life is Sweet immediately. In what is a remarkable departure, entirely on her own she has that one beat already on the first turn. Again, Smith asks her approaching the 3f pole, but this time she responds immediately, circles the field on the turn and already has the lead by the eighth pole. She cruises the last sixteenth.

When I watch those races, I see a marked difference in her mental attitude--one that made her a better racehorse.

[JT Dancer]

i agree with this, she sure didn't look all out in her last race but i don't think her races are boring her..i think she just enjoys toying with whoever is the leader in the stretch. maybe they need to spice up her works somehow but i wonder if getting after her early will just piss her off

I think I phrased it incorrectly; I think she is a little bored by how easy it all is and is finding ways to challenge herself. Kind of "let me see how long I can wait and still get to the line first" kind of challenges to herself. Smith asked her several times in the stretch in the Vanity, and she didn't seem all that interested in responding until the very end.

In a lot of ways, I think M. Smith is very much a passenger on her; she is going to do what she wants, when she wants. I still don't think it was Smith guiding her through those holes in the Santa Margarita; she was making her way and he was hanging on:)

[islandgirl45]

We may just see things differently, and if so, I would suggest we should leave it at that. But after reading your post, I thought I owed it to you to go back and watch those races again. It was a pleasure, and I thank you for sending me back to them. Let me make a few comments and a suggestion.

I don't think Gomez ever thought that it would be a good idea to try to get an edge on his stablemate by cutting her off as she started her move. I think you are absolutely right that Smith doesn't ask for run that early. If you would look at her works and read the comments made about them at the time, you will have a context in which to watch these races, I believe, in which one can see Shirreffs working to try and offset a tendency she has to be a bit lazy. I think the early feint on the inside in the Milady was tactical to that end: Smith does not like to run inside; Zenyatta does her best running on the outside; and she seldom makes her run before midway on the turn. In her workouts, the pattern has always been to keep her covered up behind a workmate, and move her outside so that the open lane is a cue to run. You can see in her early 2009 works that she is responding leisurely to that cue. In the Milady, Smith feints inside Life is Sweet early, then checks and is able to start his serious move at the usual time. I think he used the feint-and-check to get her aggressive and on the bit.

My suggestion is this: watch the Milady, followed by the Hirsch, followed by the Lady's Secret, from last year. All three are races in which Life is Sweet is in the field, and they offer a guide to changes in Zenyatta's mental attitude. In the Milady, the early inside feint triggers a serious rally that commences inside the 3f pole. In the Hirsch, Smith asks her to pick it up approaching that pole and she is slow to respond. He is asking her on the turn and she really doesn't give him run until approaching the quarter pole. Inside the eighth pole she has to drop down on her belly and get after it to get there in time. Then watch the Lady's Secret. She is much more competitive from the gate. She breaks last, and entirely on her own is up with Life is Sweet immediately. In what is a remarkable departure, entirely on her own she has that one beat already on the first turn. Again, Smith asks her approaching the 3f pole, but this time she responds immediately, circles the field on the turn and already has the lead by the eighth pole. She cruises the last sixteenth.

When I watch those races, I see a marked difference in her mental attitude--one that made her a better racehorse.

I understand your points. My take on the Milady came mostly from Smith joking after the race about Gomez's "race riding."

Smith said after the Vanity, "She needed this race," so I hope it provides whatever spark she needed.

I recall late last year, prior to the Classic, they were double-teaming her with workmates. I think they've only done that once that I know of in 2010.

Ultimately, I think Zenyatta and her races and workouts are the most micro-analyzed I've ever seen. Although, Rachel and her workouts/races may be a close second.

The boys don't seem to get the same treatment.;)

[forgotten]

I think I phrased it incorrectly; I think she is a little bored by how easy it all is and is finding ways to challenge herself. Kind of "let me see how long I can wait and still get to the line first" kind of challenges to herself. Smith asked her several times in the stretch in the Vanity, and she didn't seem all that interested in responding until the very end.

In a lot of ways, I think M. Smith is very much a passenger on her; she is going to do what she wants, when she wants. I still don't think it was Smith guiding her through those holes in the Santa Margarita; she was making her way and he was hanging on:)
With all do respect, I think you're anthropomophizing just a little bit too much here. She knows where the wire is, period. This may bit her in the *** when she ships east for the BC this year as she is not going to be on familiar turf. I'm a huge fan of hers, so obviously I hope I'm wrong.

[Horse's Rear]

It's been a long time (in my opinion) since we have had a racehorse that remains as interesting to watch as Zenyatta for as long as she has remained interesting.

[Reposmoral]

And here's yet another opinion...

First off, last year's Milady. I seem to recall in the press coverage at the time that Smith said Gomez cut him off when he tried to sneak through on the rail, and that it was a clever bit of "race riding" on Gomez's part. So, I'm skeptical that it was some kind of gimmick on Mike's part to "wake up" Zenyatta and that *he* checked her on purpose, i.e. had no intention of allowing Zenyatta to go through on the rail.

Second, last year's Vanity. I interpreted Zenyatta being slow to get going because she was lugging 129 pounds for the first time, and it took a second to get her momentum going forward. It was rather sudden, too--she was spinning her wheels for a second there, and then BOOM she was two lengths in front with her ears pricked.

Third, I agree that last year's CH may have "woke up" or at least sharpened Zenyatta. Hitting 40mph in the stretch will do that to you. Or, perhaps it was by design--why peak Zenyatta too soon over the early summer? Better that she start ramping up in the Lady's Secret and finally peaking for the BCC. But remember that Smith said that he "underestimated" the competition--not that Zenyatta was loafing and wouldn't get going.

Fourth, I agree with others that Zenyatta wasn't "all out" in the 2010 Vanity, though she was more extended than she usually needs to be--recall that normally she wins in a canter, so to see her actually running is impressive. Let us also not forget that she was lugging 129lbs again and it probably took time to really hit her stride. Smith wasn't even hitting her in the last 100 yards. Her ears were flopping back and forth. She was bright and fresh when she came back (I was there, she looked awesome!). And, I think we can all agree that she was NOT "sharp" for that race, her works leading up to it were slow because of workmate troubles, she had 8 weeks off. Also recall that her previous two races were both as easy as can be, traffic troubles in the Santa Margarita nothwithstanding, and were both run in handrides with Zenyatta just galloping. So, it's fair to say that with two really easy races, and long breaks between, and slow works, Zenyatta was not as on edge as she can be--nor would they WANT her to be, because it's a loooong way to go till the Breeder's Cup.

Also, I know horses, I own them, I've ridden them since I was a little kid. If a horse does not want to get going faster, and you ask them too or insist that they do, especially a mare, they WILL let you know what they think about THAT. In other words, I believe that if Zenyatta was "bored" and "disinterested" in racing and that was why she wasn't wanting to get going, when Mike hit her with the whip you would see a negative response--ears flattening, tail swishing. I've never seen so much as an ear flick from Zenyatta when she is struck with the whip. It's just a cue to her, "Hey, I need a little more than your usual!" And she says, "Sure boss, here we go!"

Speaking of which, Zenyatta's dirt races. One thing we have to consider is whether her habit of waiting til the last second to get going is a function of synthetic surfaces. She has only run two dirt races, so it's hard to really compare, but who didn't notice in the AB this year that Zenyatta swallowed up the field (who were running pedestrian fractions and shouldn't have been backing up at that point) way early and was in the lead at the top of the stretch. She very well might BE BETTER on dirt, or at least happier, or at least willing to run sooner. So, I will be very interested to see, if she runs on dirt again before the BC, how quickly she kicks it into gear or catches up with the field.

But I am not putting too much stock in what she does over the summer, because they are clearly not interested in getting Zenyatta too sharp, too soon. I think we're seeing an 80% Zenyatta over the summer, and if all goes well, a 90-95% Zenyatta in the early fall and 100% Zenyatta in November.

Just my humble opinion, as they say!

[islandgirl45]

And here's yet another opinion...

First off, last year's Milady. I seem to recall in the press coverage at the time that Smith said Gomez cut him off when he tried to sneak through on the rail, and that it was a clever bit of "race riding" on Gomez's part. So, I'm skeptical that it was some kind of gimmick on Mike's part to "wake up" Zenyatta and that *he* checked her on purpose, i.e. had no intention of allowing Zenyatta to go through on the rail.

Second, last year's Vanity. I interpreted Zenyatta being slow to get going because she was lugging 129 pounds for the first time, and it took a second to get her momentum going forward. It was rather sudden, too--she was spinning her wheels for a second there, and then BOOM she was two lengths in front with her ears pricked.

Third, I agree that last year's CH may have "woke up" or at least sharpened Zenyatta. Hitting 40mph in the stretch will do that to you. Or, perhaps it was by design--why peak Zenyatta too soon over the early summer? Better that she start ramping up in the Lady's Secret and finally peaking for the BCC. But remember that Smith said that he "underestimated" the competition--not that Zenyatta was loafing and wouldn't get going.

Fourth, I agree with others that Zenyatta wasn't "all out" in the 2010 Vanity, though she was more extended than she usually needs to be--recall that normally she wins in a canter, so to see her actually running is impressive. Let us also not forget that she was lugging 129lbs again and it probably took time to really hit her stride. Smith wasn't even hitting her in the last 100 yards. Her ears were flopping back and forth. She was bright and fresh when she came back (I was there, she looked awesome!). And, I think we can all agree that she was NOT "sharp" for that race, her works leading up to it were slow because of workmate troubles, she had 8 weeks off. Also recall that her previous two races were both as easy as can be, traffic troubles in the Santa Margarita nothwithstanding, and were both run in handrides with Zenyatta just galloping. So, it's fair to say that with two really easy races, and long breaks between, and slow works, Zenyatta was not as on edge as she can be--nor would they WANT her to be, because it's a loooong way to go till the Breeder's Cup.

Also, I know horses, I own them, I've ridden them since I was a little kid. If a horse does not want to get going faster, and you ask them too or insist that they do, especially a mare, they WILL let you know what they think about THAT. In other words, I believe that if Zenyatta was "bored" and "disinterested" in racing and that was why she wasn't wanting to get going, when Mike hit her with the whip you would see a negative response--ears flattening, tail swishing. I've never seen so much as an ear flick from Zenyatta when she is struck with the whip. It's just a cue to her, "Hey, I need a little more than your usual!" And she says, "Sure boss, here we go!"

Speaking of which, Zenyatta's dirt races. One thing we have to consider is whether her habit of waiting til the last second to get going is a function of synthetic surfaces. She has only run two dirt races, so it's hard to really compare, but who didn't notice in the AB this year that Zenyatta swallowed up the field (who were running pedestrian fractions and shouldn't have been backing up at that point) way early and was in the lead at the top of the stretch. She very well might BE BETTER on dirt, or at least happier, or at least willing to run sooner. So, I will be very interested to see, if she runs on dirt again before the BC, how quickly she kicks it into gear or catches up with the field.

But I am not putting too much stock in what she does over the summer, because they are clearly not interested in getting Zenyatta too sharp, too soon. I think we're seeing an 80% Zenyatta over the summer, and if all goes well, a 90-95% Zenyatta in the early fall and 100% Zenyatta in November.

Just my humble opinion, as they say!

I think your opinion is on target. Bored, disinterested horses lose races.

[Ezariah]

I was on the track with Zen when she came back and if you didn't know better, you would never know she had just ran a race. JT Dancer was close enough to her that she could see that as well. I have tons of photos of her as she trotted back, walked around, went into and out of the winner's circle, etc. Except for under her saddle cloth, she was perfectly dry and breathing normally. Zen was never worried in that race. Everyone else nearly had a heart attack, but she knew perfectly well what she was doing. Imo, she does it on purpose.

ST did look tired, but not overly so, imo. Her ears were straight up as she trotted back. I have photos of her being unsaddled. She was wet, but not that bad. She did run her heart out though, and deserved the ovation she got from the crowd.


I think it was Faith, or perhaps another poster, who saw her after the race and said she wasn't even blowing. I remember she did her prance in the winner's circle and even picked up one of her back feet to threaten a little cowkick to someone who walked too closely behind her. The same person who saw both Zenyatta and St Trinians after the race said St Trinians looked tired.

Jay Hovdey from DRF also wrote of St Trinians..."Her front legs going all directions, the British mare gave as much as you can give to a race and still be upright at the end. Standing there afterwards, being unsaddled in the backwash of the Zenyatta din, she was spent, dizzy and noble. I hope she knew some of that noise was for her."

[MR.W]

With all do respect, I think you're anthropomophizing just a little bit too much here. She knows where the wire is, period. This may bit her in the *** when she ships east for the BC this year as she is not going to be on familiar turf. I'm a huge fan of hers, so obviously I hope I'm wrong.
If anything, the longer stretch run at Churchill will be to her advantage if she indeed waits longer to get going.

[GinTalking]

If anything, the longer stretch run at Churchill will be to her advantage if she indeed waits longer to get going.

Exactly. Santa Anita has a relatively short stretch. Even Pimlico's stretch is longer than SA.

[forgotten]

If anything, the longer stretch run at Churchill will be to her advantage if she indeed waits longer to get going.

How does it compare to HP and DelMar? I think the synth to dirt thing will be the primary thing in her favour come BCC time.

[MR.W]

How does it compare to HP and DelMar? I think the synth to dirt thing will be the primary thing in her favour come BCC time.

Somebody can look it up, but Del Mar is the shortest stretch run and HP and SA are longer at somewhere around 1000 feet. I believe CD is 1234 feet which much longer. Just think about Zenyatta getting started and shifting gears with 220 feet more than she regularly has. The added distance is definitely to her advantage.

[FastG45]

Somebody can look it up


Distance from last turn to finish line:

Del Mar - 919 ft.
SA - 990 ft.
Hollywood - 991 ft.
CD - 1234.5 ft.

[weatherbird]

Distance from last turn to finish line:

Del Mar - 919 ft.
SA - 990 ft.
Hollywood - 991 ft.
CD - 1234.5 ft.
just for reference, 1/4 pole is 1320 feet and 3/16th pole is 990 feet

[forgotten]

Thanks for the stats! I can see how CD may just be to her liking. Let's just hope she makes it there fit, sound and happy....

[Dusty]

I just hope they stay away from DelMar....She was not a happy camper there last year!

[The Tin Man]

I just hope they stay away from DelMar....She was not a happy camper there last year!

I've gotta think that no matter what she will be running in the Clement Hirsch.

I don't see them shipping her out of SoCal until The Breeder's Cup at this point and if they didn't run her at Del Mar ... They sure wouldn't be running her at Fairplex.

Oak Tree starts on September 29th ... So skipping Del Mar and not shipping would be 3 1/2 to 4 months off between races and that's not gonna happen.

My money is on her running in The Clement Hirsch regardless of anything they say.

And if she does, once again, St Trinians is gonna be incredibly tough. Her last race out was not a fluke. It was pretty much her standard effort.

[weatherbird]

I've gotta think that no matter what she will be running in the Clement Hirsch.
My money is on her running in The Clement Hirsch regardless of anything they say.
What would get my attention, while keeping her at home, would be putting her in the John Mabee (or even the Eddie Read) going 1 1/8 on grass. However, they mostly want to be 19 for 19 going to Churchill Downs so they won't be considering any such "out of the box" options.

[The Tin Man]

What would get my attention, while keeping her at home, would be putting her in the John Mabee (or even the Eddie Read) going 1 1/8 on grass. However, they mostly want to be 19 for 19 going to Churchill Downs so they won't be considering any such "out of the box" options.

Yeah ... I'd love that too. The female turf division in Cali is pretty weak right now. It would be a good time to try it.

But like you, I don't see them stepping out of the box and trying turf. But I think she could do it.

[Curlin]

Just curious, since the connections are on the fence about the Hirsch, does anyone know what other stakes Zenyatta is nominated to this summer / early fall?

[MonmouthGuy]

Just curious, since the connections are on the fence about the Hirsch, does anyone know what other stakes Zenyatta is nominated to this summer / early fall?

None yet.

In my opinion, it will be Hirsch or a break until the Lady's Secret.

[drjohnh]

i saw an interview with mike after the apple blossom where he said he didn't mean for her to start her run early. she was running with her head and shoulders up because she was annoyed by the dirt hitting her in the face. so he moved her out a little to get out of the kickback and she thought she was supposed to go.
he said he briefly worried that it would affect her run to get going early but of course, as it turned out..not a problem

[The Tin Man]

None yet.

In my opinion, it will be Hirsch or a break until the Lady's Secret.

She'll be running in the Hirsch ... I see no other way.

You REALLY think they'd take a 4 month break in between races and only run in The Lady's Secret between June 13th and the Breeder's Cup MG??? Really?

There's exactly 4 months in between The Vanity and The Lady's Secret.

That would be horrific strategy if they're expecting to win The Classic.

[EquineAnne]

None yet.

In my opinion, it will be Hirsch or a break until the Lady's Secret.

If it's the former, I won't be watching until it's over.

[forgotten]

If it's the former, I won't be watching until it's over.

For a horse running such a boring schedule, she throws her share of nailbiters.....

[The Tin Man]

If it's the former, I won't be watching until it's over.

Ohhhhhhhh yeah ... If St Trinians is in the Hirsch against her ... It's gonna be one heck of a dogfight! I look forward to it!

But as much as I love and respect St Trinians, I still want Zenny to win. I still love her more. :becky:

[Secretariat Forever]

For a horse running such a boring schedule, she throws her share of nailbiters.....


Can you blame her? She's probably getting bored herself and is trying to create some different kind of excitement in her races. :p

[EquineAnne]

For a horse running such a boring schedule, she throws her share of nailbiters.....

that's for darn sure. :scared:

[speckledpuppy]

She'll be running in the Hirsch ... I see no other way.

You REALLY think they'd take a 4 month break in between races and only run in The Lady's Secret between June 13th and the Breeder's Cup MG??? Really?

There's exactly 4 months in between The Vanity and The Lady's Secret.

That would be horrific strategy if they're expecting to win The Classic.

I agree with you. There seems to be something going on because they are much more quiet right now then ever before. Yes ?

[Horse's Rear]

Speaking of quiet, Belmont likes to advertise their importance--they bill their Fall Season as the "Fall Championship Meet." Earlier this year, NYRA said that it might have to close after the Belmont Stakes, if it didn't get a loan. So they weren't posting the Fall Stakes Schedule, and Saratoga might have to be cancelled. Fortunately, they were able to borrow the money, and Saratoga will be running races and serving as a training facility for horses racing at Monmouth. But Belmont still hasn't announced its Fall Stakes Schedule. It's supposed to start in about 60 days. Does that mean that there won't be any champions this year? Or just that Belmont can't get their act together enough to issue a press release? What's the holdup? Or have they issued the press release (by carrier pigeon?) and just not updated their website?

[ElPrado1]

No, they didn't use carrier pigeon. They used a mole. One problem, Central Park grounds keepers killed the mole, so NYRA has to go find him, dig him up, and try to find Mrs Mole. Then try to con the Park staff to leave her alone.:eyebrows:

[forgotten]

I agree with you. There seems to be something going on because they are much more quiet right now then ever before. Yes ?
No, you're confusing them with Jess Jackson.

[Spahny]

I think if she runs in the Hirsch she loses. The 8.5 at Del Mar is not her trip, especially with where she is at now.

I have also begun to wonder if Zenyatta is losing interest and bored. It might be a good time to shake her up. I have an idea about how but it will never happen. Some might find it an odd choice.

I always like to play routers shortening up to the 7 furlong sprint. It's one angle that works very, very well and at all levels of competition.

And it would be very different.

[forgotten]

I think if she runs in the Hirsch she loses. The 8.5 at Del Mar is not her trip, especially with where she is at now.

I have also begun to wonder if Zenyatta is losing interest and bored. It might be a good time to shake her up. I have an idea about how but it will never happen. Some might find it an odd choice.

I always like to play routers shortening up to the 7 furlong sprint. It's one angle that works very, very well and at all levels of competition.

And it would be very different.

I'm hoping The Vanity shook her up enough that she'll run better in the Hirsch this year. At any rate, I would hope that Smith is aware enough of potential problems to get her in the open and rolling a bit earlier.....I'm not anticipating that race to be as close this year as it was before nor do I think St T will get as close to her at the wire again.

[Spahny]

My other choice would be a mile and a quarter at Saratoga in the Personal Ensign.

If she goes in the Hirsch, I think she loses. And then that might be it.

It's not easy handling these animals. I'm only guessing from the sidelines. She is as talented as ever. But she needs some stimulation. That's how I see it.

[Dusty]

I think if she runs in the Hirsch she loses. The 8.5 at Del Mar is not her trip, especially with where she is at now.

I have also begun to wonder if Zenyatta is losing interest and bored. It might be a good time to shake her up. I have an idea about how but it will never happen. Some might find it an odd choice.

I always like to play routers shortening up to the 7 furlong sprint. It's one angle that works very, very well and at all levels of competition.

And it would be very different.

I agree - too short and she is NOT happy at DelMar!

[JT Dancer]

Does anyone have St. Trinians in their virtual stable? Has she returned to the track since the race? It will be interesting to see if she moves forward from the race or regresses some; it was a tough outing for her.

eta: She has had a work per Equibase.

Hollywood Park6/28/10http://www.equibase.com/images/spc.gifAll Weather Trackhttp://www.equibase.com/images/spc.gif4F50.80BreezingRank 37/42

[GreenasGrass]

ST last worked on Jun 28, 4f in 50-4.

[Sheepish]

As an acetate equine aficionado (model horse nut) may I present the official Zenyatta Breyer, coming this fall:

170
Also, Z will be made into a Christmas ornament along with Rachel, too cool!

171 172

[DesertHeat]

I saw the big mare this morning for the first time since the last race. As per usual, I like to judge for myself how she is doing rather than hear it from anyone else. A racing reporter was there and commented that she's like a metronome.... the same, day in, day out, every day, for three seasons now. Tick, tick, tick, tick....

She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up, and didn't seem phased at all by the crazy two year olds that were bucking and running off all around her (9:45 am on the training track is practically a playground for the babies!).

[islandgirl45]

I saw the big mare this morning for the first time since the last race. As per usual, I like to judge for myself how she is doing rather than hear it from anyone else. A racing reporter was there and commented that she's like a metronome.... the same, day in, day out, every day, for three seasons now. Tick, tick, tick, tick....

She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up, and didn't seem phased at all by the crazy two year olds that were bucking and running off all around her (9:45 am on the training track is practically a playground for the babies!).

Was the exercise rider holding her back or does she normally gallop with her neck arched like that?

[Hermes]

Great report on her DH. I think that is the truest test of a champion - the ability to stay that good day in, day out, race in, race out as long as your humans don't screw something up or get greedy - which Z's have not.

[DesertHeat]

Was the exercise rider holding her back or does she normally gallop with her neck arched like that?

A combination of both

[Dusty]

As an acetate equine aficionado (model horse nut) may I present the official Zenyatta Breyer, coming this fall:

170
Also, Z will be made into a Christmas ornament along with Rachel, too cool!

171 172

NOT the best rendition of Z THUMBS DOWN - B:rant:LAH

[Secretariat Forever]

I saw the big mare this morning for the first time since the last race. As per usual, I like to judge for myself how she is doing rather than hear it from anyone else. A racing reporter was there and commented that she's like a metronome.... the same, day in, day out, every day, for three seasons now. Tick, tick, tick, tick....

She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up, and didn't seem phased at all by the crazy two year olds that were bucking and running off all around her (9:45 am on the training track is practically a playground for the babies!).


thanks for keeping us updated!

[JT Dancer]

NOT the best rendition of Z THUMBS DOWN - B:rant:LAH

At least it's better than the bobblehead:)

[Sheepish]

At least it's better than the bobblehead:)

Yeah That. Plus Breyer is notorious for taking really bad promotional photos of upcoming releases. As I'm a collector, I try to plan what models I'd like to pick up, but ones I like in photos sometimes turn out to be blah in person, and ones I thought were ugly turn out to be much better in person. So I wouldn't be too surprised if her model looks better in person.

[Spahny]

It's not her physical status that concerns me. But it's nice to know she is feeling well. She's the most unique, special thoroughbred I have ever had to pleasure of following. We won't see this again. She owes us nothing at this point.

And I really hope she doesn't run in the Hirsch.

[Rick1323]

My other choice would be a mile and a quarter at Saratoga in the Personal Ensign.

If she goes in the Hirsch, I think she loses. And then that might be it.

It's not easy handling these animals. I'm only guessing from the sidelines. She is as talented as ever. But she needs some stimulation. That's how I see it.


It is all perspective. I think they are sitting on the same horse they were at the same time last year. I think she will move up off the last one. The problem is they still have a long way till the BCC. Keeping her sharp till Nov will not be easy. But I do agree that if she loses, it is all over for her. They know that once she goes over the top, there is no bringing her back.

[Codysmom55]

It's not her physical status that concerns me. But it's nice to know she is feeling well. She's the most unique, special thoroughbred I have ever had to pleasure of following. We won't see this again. She owes us nothing at this point.

And I really hope she doesn't run in the Hirsch.

This.

[GinTalking]

I'm not a 'model' person at all. Give me a good sculpture, but I've never had a Breyer horse in my life.

That said, I kind of like all three of those. Maybe they look horrible if you actually have one in your hands, but from those images, they look about right to me. Not bad.

[islandgirl45]

It is all perspective. I think they are sitting on the same horse they were at the same time last year. I think she will move up off the last one. The problem is they still have a long way till the BCC. Keeping her sharp till Nov will not be easy. But I do agree that if she loses, it is all over for her. They know that once she goes over the top, there is no bringing her back.


What does this mean, exactly? I've never seen more epitaphs written for an undefeated champion horse than the ones I've seen here. After she wins a race, it's strange to see people write "OMG she's doomed!" Then the micro-analyzing starts, as if some folks have psychic powers and can read her thoughts and feelings.

DesertHeat just wrote that he saw her in person and "She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up." Dappled horses are happy horses, yes? Galloping aggressively is a good thing, yes?
Or do some of you believe she's faking her dapples and she's really depressed?

[Sheepish]

Dappled horses are happy horses, yes? Galloping aggressively is a good thing, yes?
Or do some of you believe she's faking her dapples and she's really depressed?

Well, I know my undappled pony is depressed, but I think is has more to do with my other undappled pony galloping aggressively at him last night and biting chunks off him. This galloping aggressively was not a good thing. Of course, if my aggressive undappled pony had dapples, he might have been happier, and therefore less likely to act like an undomesticated savage. Then the first pony wouldn't have gotten beat up, but it's hard to say if he'd be less depressed, lacking dapples and all... hmm. (Can you tell I got no sleep last night?)

[Codysmom55]

What does this mean, exactly? I've never seen more epitaphs written for an undefeated champion horse than the ones I've seen here. After she wins a race, it's strange to see people write "OMG she's doomed!" Then the micro-analyzing starts, as if some folks have psychic powers and can read her thoughts and feelings.

DesertHeat just wrote that he saw her in person and "She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up." Dappled horses are happy horses, yes? Galloping aggressively is a good thing, yes?
Or do some of you believe she's faking her dapples and she's really depressed?

LOL. I think she's fine. Maybe a bit bored, but I remember after she narrowly defeated Tough Tiz's Sis she had distance limitations according to many. I remember her narrow defeat of Anaaba's Creation and how people have held that performance up as some trophy of vulnerability. Very seldom is it mentioned that the next race, Z daylighted that filly in a hand ride. St. Trinians put up a very courageous battle and here we are. When Mike galloped Z back to the winner's circle after the Vanity, her ears were straight up the entire way back around and she was cantering fluidly and easily. It's on the video and that's what I'm going on.

[Horsebagger]

What does this mean, exactly? I've never seen more epitaphs written for an undefeated champion horse than the ones I've seen here. After she wins a race, it's strange to see people write "OMG she's doomed!" Then the micro-analyzing starts, as if some folks have psychic powers and can read her thoughts and feelings.

DesertHeat just wrote that he saw her in person and "She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up." Dappled horses are happy horses, yes? Galloping aggressively is a good thing, yes?
Or do some of you believe she's faking her dapples and she's really depressed?


The man said affirmatively that he thinks they are sitting on the same horse as they were this time last year and that she will likley move up off of her last race. But you decide to react to a "what if" statement that is perfectly vaild and understandable in its suggestion as if it is a blanket indictment of everyone blasting the mare.

Overly sensitive?

[Rick1323]

What does this mean, exactly? I've never seen more epitaphs written for an undefeated champion horse than the ones I've seen here. After she wins a race, it's strange to see people write "OMG she's doomed!" Then the micro-analyzing starts, as if some folks have psychic powers and can read her thoughts and feelings.

DesertHeat just wrote that he saw her in person and "She was covered in dapples, galloped aggressively with her head bowed and her ears up." Dappled horses are happy horses, yes? Galloping aggressively is a good thing, yes?
Or do some of you believe she's faking her dapples and she's really depressed?


You didn't read the first part of my post? I said that I thought she would move up off her last race. I added that I thought she was in the same form at the same time of the year as last season. I actually still think she can win the BCC again.

But I agree with Spahny that if she were to lose they would stop with her. She is 6 years old and is not likely to learn to love racing again once she sours a little. Going sour or getting hurt are the only way I can see her getting beat. She is the best mare I have ever seen, but when you bet horses you learn that there are no absolutes....not even with an undefeated horse.

[The Tin Man]

It's not her physical status that concerns me. But it's nice to know she is feeling well. She's the most unique, special thoroughbred I have ever had to pleasure of following. We won't see this again. She owes us nothing at this point.

And I really hope she doesn't run in the Hirsch.

I believe they're going to run her in the Hirsch no matter what doubt they might cast. They've got to run during that meet and take their chances.(They'll likely win regardless). If they skip the Del Mar meet and wait for The Oak Tree meet, that would be 4 months in between races and would only allow them 1 race before The Breeder's Cup. That's hardly a recipe for victory.

Regardless of how tough the Del Mar surface is to her, she'll likely win. If she takes 4 months off and then runs in 1 race at Oak Tree, I sure as heck don't see that as a good way to prep for The Breeder's Cup. The pretty much have no choice, but to run at Del Mar or ship Eastward and I don't see them shipping Eastward.

[speckledpuppy]

I believe they're going to run her in the Hirsch no matter what doubt they might cast. They've got to run during that meet and take their chances.(They'll likely win regardless). If they skip the Del Mar meet and wait for The Oak Tree meet, that would be 4 months in between races and would only allow them 1 race before The Breeder's Cup. That's hardly a recipe for victory.

Regardless of how tough the Del Mar surface is to her, she'll likely win. If she takes 4 months off and then runs in 1 race at Oak Tree, I sure as heck don't see that as a good way to prep for The Breeder's Cup. The pretty much have no choice, but to run at Del Mar or ship Eastward and I don't see them shipping Eastward.

It makes no sense to run at Del Mar. Ship to Saratoga train at one of the best training tracks in the country and race in the Personal Ensign on her preferred distance on her preferred surface. The Beldame should follow which would lead right into the Classic.

[The Tin Man]

It makes no sense to run at Del Mar. Ship to Saratoga train at one of the best training tracks in the country and race in the Personal Ensign on her preferred distance on her preferred surface. The Beldame should follow which would lead right into the Classic.

If they don't ship Eastward, do you think it makes more sense to take 4 months off in between races and have 1 prep on the West Coast before shipping to Churchill for the Breeder's Cup? Because that's what is likely to happen if she doesn't run at Del Mar.

I don't see them shipping to the East Coast until the Breeder's Cup. So it's either run at Del Mar or take 4 months off between races and run 1 prep at Oak Tree and then ship to The Breeder's Cup. Which sounds like a horrible option to me, if they want her on top of her game.

[islandgirl45]

The man said affirmatively that he thinks they are sitting on the same horse as they were this time last year and that she will likley move up off of her last race. But you decide to react to a "what if" statement that is perfectly vaild and understandable in its suggestion as if it is a blanket indictment of everyone blasting the mare.

Overly sensitive?

I think "overly sensitive" could more accurately be applied to the epitaph writers than me. I just questioned the practice and the "over the top, she's done, no bringing her back" idea, that's all.


You didn't read the first part of my post?Yes, I did Rick1323. It wasn't the first part I commented on. It was the part about "if she loses she's done...if she sours" part.

We just happen to disagree on that, because I don't think they retire her if she loses a race, as long as she still shows them that she still wants to run. I don't think losing a race = sour attitude. Losing a race can happen to any horse at any time.

[weatherbird]

I believe they're going to run her in the Hirsch no matter what doubt they might cast. They've got to run during that meet and take their chances.(They'll likely win regardless). If they skip the Del Mar meet and wait for The Oak Tree meet, that would be 4 months in between races and would only allow them 1 race before The Breeder's Cup. That's hardly a recipe for victory.

Regardless of how tough the Del Mar surface is to her, she'll likely win. If she takes 4 months off and then runs in 1 race at Oak Tree, I sure as heck don't see that as a good way to prep for The Breeder's Cup. The pretty much have no choice, but to run at Del Mar or ship Eastward and I don't see them shipping Eastward.
put her in the John Mabee on the lawn. that'll wake the old mare up!

[The Tin Man]

put her in the John Mabee on the lawn. that'll wake the old mare up!

I'd be all for it. She's gotta run something at Del Mar. Although I have a strong feeling that she would find a way to win The Hirsch. She always finds a way. They can't just sit her out for almost 4 months and go with 1 West Coast prep.

I don't think it's logical to think they would ship her Eastward before the Breeder's Cup at this point.

So whatever she does, it's gonna have to be at Del Mar. I can't see a 4 month break as an option at all.

[forgotten]

I have to agree they wont' ship her prior to BC. If it is true she didn't adjust well when shipping for the AB, then I think they'll just ship her one more time and that's for the BCC. Del Mar may not be her best track, but I'm looking for a better race and a more head's up ride from Smith this time around. I think they put enough of a scare into most of us in The Vanity...

[Curlin]

The heck with the Hirsch and the Mabee - just run her in the Pacific Classic. At least the timing would be good between then and the Oak Tree race. It would however mean she could possibly not have a race till then, and while she runs well fresh, if she's going to the Classic it wouldn't hurt to get another prep into her.

Glad to hear she's doing well, DH. Oh, those dapples!

[Horse's Rear]

I'd be all for it. She's gotta run something at Del Mar.

So whatever she does, it's gonna have to be at Del Mar. I can't see a 4 month break as an option at all.
You're forgetting the Ralph Hinds Pomona Invitational--get her a start on dirt without shipping.

[The Tin Man]

You're forgetting the Ralph Hinds Pomona Invitational--get her a start on dirt without shipping.

Ohhhhhhh yeah! That LONG stretch run at Fairplex will give her tons of time to wind up! :lol:

Good one HR! I'd forgotten about that option. :becky:

[Horse's Rear]

It might really wake her up. She'd lope out of the gate and before she got her bearings find out she was already turning left and heading for home. She'd probably belly on down and start running the first time through the lane. By the time she got around the second time, she'd probably be wondering "Jeezus, how many laps is this?!" That might shake her out of that "I'll just wait a little longer" approach.

And it would be fun to watch.

[The Tin Man]

It might really wake her up. She'd lope out of the gate and before she got her bearings find out she was already turning left and heading for home. She'd probably belly on down and start running the first time through the lane. By the time she got around the second time, she'd probably be wondering "Jeezus, how many laps is this?!" That might shake her out of that "I'll just wait a little longer" approach.

And it would be fun to watch.

It would be extremely interesting indeed. :becky:

[Spahny]

And I thought my notion of shortening up to 7 furlongs was creative.

If she ran at Fairplex I would take her to the outer rail and keep here there all the way around the track. And Fairplex would have some genuine circus money to make the race attractive for Jess Jackson.

[Horse's Rear]

Speaking of quiet, Belmont likes to advertise their importance--they bill their Fall Season as the "Fall Championship Meet." Earlier this year, NYRA said that it might have to close after the Belmont Stakes, if it didn't get a loan. So they weren't posting the Fall Stakes Schedule, and Saratoga might have to be cancelled. Fortunately, they were able to borrow the money, and Saratoga will be running races and serving as a training facility for horses racing at Monmouth. But Belmont still hasn't announced its Fall Stakes Schedule. It's supposed to start in about 60 days. Does that mean that there won't be any champions this year? Or just that Belmont can't get their act together enough to issue a press release? What's the holdup? Or have they issued the press release (by carrier pigeon?) and just not updated their website?

I guess the answer is in Hayward's interview with Nick Kling referenced on the front page. Kling mentions the loan and asks if this means NYRA is financially sound for the rest of the year. The answer is that they are sound through Saratoga and the opening of Belmont's fall meet, but not through the whole meet. Hayward is confident (it's his job to be confident) that at least a partial deal will be worked out on VLTs in time to stabilize the fall meet. But I guess they can't put out the stakes calendar until they have more of a commitment to get through the meet. I believe that they are trying to trim $2M from last year's stakes budget.

[Man o' Taz]

It sounds like Mike Smith is going to have to push her to start her run earlier.

This comment from Jerry Moss is interesting to me:
I wonder if 1-1/16 miles isn't a bit short for Zen as well.

I know its been almont a year since she ran in such a race, but I frankly am not worried.

I think she has recorded some of her best times and figures...in those races. After all, 9 of her 17 wins have come in 8.5 furlong races. She ran in three last year. Her BC prep races in 08 and 09 have been at the distance and they have been stellar performances where she has defeated the likes of Hystericalady, Cocoa Beach and Life Is Sweet.

I continue to trust her abilities here.

They want to stay home in California. There are no more mile and an eighth races for her to run in there between now and the Breeders Cup. If they wanted more distance they could have run in the HGC and stayed home. Now, if they want more distance they have to leave the state.

I always suggested not running her in the HGC was going to back them into a corner...and it seems that it is but I think its much ado. :)



Yes, I did Rick1323. It wasn't the first part I commented on. It was the part about "if she loses she's done...if she sours" part.

We just happen to disagree on that, because I don't think they retire her if she loses a race, as long as she still shows them that she still wants to run. I don't think losing a race = sour attitude. Losing a race can happen to any horse at any time.

I think you are absolutely right. If she loses there is no reason to retire her. She will have already lost her undefeated status. If she loses at a distance that her connections feel is less than ideal, than running her in a longer race like the Classic would look more attractive I think. Now, if she were to lose her next TWO races, that might give them pause depending upon the cirucmstances of the losses.

Posted on Mon, Jul. 12, 2010 01:29 PM

Two horse race continues in NTRA Poll

By Sports Network

Following a one week break from voting in the NTRA National Poll, the same two horses remain on top of the tabulation. Champion mare Zenyatta holds a narrow lead over four-year-old colt Quality Road.

With both thoroughbreds perfect this year in three starts, Zenyatta has a four point lead on Quality Road, despite receiving seven more first-place votes.

Zenyatta, undefeated in 17 career starts, has 13 first-place votes and 178 points, one less point than two weeks ago. The six-year-old champion is expected to make her next start on August 7 at Del Mar in the Clement L. Hirsch, a race she has won the last two years.

Quality Road is steady with six first-place votes and 174 points. The winner of the Met Mile will also make his next start on August 7, but in the Whitney Handicap at Saratoga Race Course.

The next three spots are unchanged from the last poll: Blame (120), Rachel Alexandra (111) and Lookin At Lucky (101).


Read more: http://www.kansascity.com/2010/07/12/2078058/two-horse-race-continues-in-ntra.html#ixzz0tZoeSF3V

[Ezariah]

Zenyatta (http://www.equibase.com/premium/eqpHorseMPPByHorse.cfm?refno=7156465&SAP=HPV&BT=TB) (6-Year-Old Mare)

Date: July 13, 2010
Track: HOLLYWOOD PARK
Distance: Six Furlongs
Time: 1.14:40 Handily
Track Condition: Fast
Surface: All Weather Track
Rank: 4/7 - See the day's workouts (http://www.equibase.com/static/workout/HOL071310USA-EQB.html#ZENYATTA)

[Hermes]

She'd like her thread back.

[islandgirl45]

Brendan O'Meara at HorseraceInsider wrotes a tongue-in-cheek column about Breeders Cup contestants, starting with Zenyatta.
http://www.horseraceinsider.com/carryover-2-0/trick-or-treat-treat/

Trick or Treat? Treat!
“ ... All this and Andy Rooney on 60 Minutes.”

Horse racing's worst bet will be viewed over 13 million people on Halloween and she won’t be asking for Snickers, Kit-Kats, or Reeses’ Peanut Butter Cups. Zenyatta will breeze onto CBS for a piece on 60 Minutes.
Who gets the by-line? Morley Safer? Steve Croft? Anderson Cooper? It doesn’t matter because this will be seen by more people than the World Series.
The Paulick Report, always eager to slip a ‘Z’ into a headline broadcasted the news “Zixty MinuteZ.” Almost as good as “Zeventeen.” Gives me a craving for FroZted FlakeZ.
What’s amazing about what Zenyatta’s done for her connections is that she has drowned out her owner’s 2005 Kentucky Derby win with Giacomo. Zeriously? When was the last time you even thought about Giacomo? All I have to say is that Zenyatta’s win streak will come to a screeching halt if she’s bred to him.
This is bigger than “Secretariat.” This is because it’s topical. She’s alive. She’s racing and she will stomp on the throats of her competitors..........

Maybe the best excerpt........
If Mine That Bird wins the Dirt Mile I will write my next column in the nude and be the cover model when I launch The Carryover Body Issue just like ESPN The Magazine did (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/flash/zoomGallery?section=gen&photoGalleryId=5650718). I can pull that off. Now to get the baby boomers involved ... Don’t forget the hand sanitizer.

[Noble]

The chief complaint against Zenyatta, made by people who could be reputable, is that she has spent too much time in the SoCal phoniness, the racing surfaces and the lightweight competition. But once at a track in Nebraska, which is Ak-Sar-Ben spelled backward, my uncle and I watched a race during which an undefeated inexpensive claimer went up against a proven stakes horse. The rap against the undefeated horse was that he hadn't beaten much, by much. But he won this one and paid a small fortune. After redeeming a ticket, my uncle said that you can never blame anybody or anything for winning, words to cash by.

Anybody can pick against Zenyatta.

But to keep from being just another media mouth in search of an audience, any audience, you have to also pick the winner.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/horse/breederscup2010/columns/story?columnist=cronley_jay&id=5726569

[second_glance]

Photo and blurb about Z in LA Magazine -- "Wonder Girl: A mare gallops out of the west and into the history books."

Image here if you're on FB

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=470832990928&set=a.459028710928.213630.142414735928

[DesertHeat]

I am writing a letter to them thanking them - we need to do all we can to ensure that they know we appreciate all Zenyatta coverage. If we don't tell them it's important...

[Hermes]

I think the belongs under Z news as one of her biggest cheerleaders in the press, and in New York no less, is blogging just for her. His Horse of the Year no matter what, and dammit she was screwed last year, too!

In the most important news of the day, it turns out that the field for the 2009 BC Classic was much much better than the rest of us realized. And Rachel's campaign wasn't historic, it was just "clever."

Well all that may be Joe, but I hope someone explains to you that when Z stays in CA in all girl races for the year on synthetic, it does eliminate the boys from going to find her, and none of the fillies and mares based on the east coast would have ventured over the Rockies west bound with or without Zv.2010.

http://therail.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/10/26/the-rail-returns-for-the-breeders-cup/

[The Tin Man]

In the most important news of the day, it turns out that the field for the 2009 BC Classic was much much better than the rest of us realized.


Ahhhhhh ... See ... I'm not the only one who realizes this after all Sunshine. ;-)

[Hermes]

Ahhhhhh ... See ... I'm not the only one who realizes this after all Sunshine. ;-)

True. And extremely biased suck up who unfortunately writes for arguably the most important newspaper in the US agrees with you. But you aren't as biased or beholden as he, your point of view is a more honest mistake;)

[The Tin Man]

True. And extremely biased suck up who unfortunately writes for arguably the most important newspaper in the US agrees with you. But you aren't as biased or beholden as he, your point of view is a more honest mistake;)

Yeah ... For some reason I think experience at the distance and veteran horses who have performed at the highest level for years means something ... I'm SOOOOOO misguided ... Please lead me to the light Sunshine! :evil:

[stark]

Zenyatta May Start Training on Dirt This Week

By Blood-Horse Staff
Updated: Tuesday, October 26, 2010 4:18 PM
Posted: Tuesday, October 26, 2010 3:57 PM

Two-time champion Zenyatta, preparing to defend her Breeders’ Cup Classic (gr. I) title and perfect 19-0 record, didn’t make life easy on regular exercise rider Steve Willard the morning of Oct. 26 as he had to use all his strength to pull her up after a 1 1/2-mile gallop over the Hollywood Park main track.

“That was a good gallop,” said trainer John Shirreffs in a statement. “No concerns at this point. Although, I do want to get her on the (dirt) training track again this week and off the synthetics.”

“She did great,” added Willard in a release. “Just terrific. She didn’t want to pull up and said, ‘hey, let’s do some more.’”

Zenyatta, owned by Jerry and Ann Moss, will continue to gallop the remainder of the week and her final timed workout will be Saturday, Oct. 30. She is scheduled to leave California for Kentucky Nov. 2.

[Secretariat Forever]

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/59512/zenyatta-may-start-training-on-dirt-this-week

Link to the above article.



I'm guessing her final timed work will be on the dirt training track?

She sounds ready to do something big! Nervous to see how she takes to Churchill. Hopefully as well as she did last year.

[Hermes]

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/59512/zenyatta-may-start-training-on-dirt-this-week

Link to the above article.



I'm guessing her final timed work will be on the dirt training track?

She sounds ready to do something big! Nervous to see how she takes to Churchill. Hopefully as well as she did last year.

I think she will still work on main track, he wants to gallop her on dirt track - he has been avoiding it this week due to wet weather.

[DesertHeat]

Er... that article title is kind of misleading, don't you think? She trains on dirt almost every day of her life for the last 3 years with the exception being the day before a work and the day of a work. Someone just kind of twisted his words, saying that he wants to return to the training track like normal when it dries out.

[Reposmoral]

Er... that article title is kind of misleading, don't you think? She trains on dirt almost every day of her life for the last 3 years with the exception being the day before a work and the day of a work. Someone just kind of twisted his words, saying that he wants to return to the training track like normal when it dries out.



That was exactly what I thought, too, DH. The implication in the wording is that training on the dirt track is like some new special preparation *just for* BC at Churchill, like he wants to get her used to dirt only now, when in reality she's been on it consistently for years and has only been off it the last few days because of rain.

Oh well.

My assumption, actually, is that he feels the dirt training track is kinder to her than the synthetic track, and that's why he wants her back on it.

[islandgirl45]

I think she will still work on main track, he wants to gallop her on dirt track - he has been avoiding it this week due to wet weather.

Hollywood's dirt training track is pretty short, isn't it? I read something a while ago that she usually works on the main track, and she goes on the training track when she's just jogging or galloping.

[Ezariah]

I believe it's only a 1/4 mile. As far as I know, no horse works on the training track.


Hollywood's dirt training track is pretty short, isn't it? I read something a while ago that she usually works on the main track, and she goes on the training track when she's just jogging or galloping.

[breezing]

I believe it's only a 1/4 mile. As far as I know, no horse works on the training track.
it's a half mile track and she was on it sunday. you are correct, no "workouts" allowed, at least that's what the sign says :).

technically, for those that are curious, the sign reads "horses are not allowed to work on the training track".

[Blue Jeans]

REMINDER:

Don't forget to watch 60 Minutes this Sunday night, Oct. 31st at 7:00pm EDT. Zenyatta will be featured in one of their segments! Program might be late airing due to football running overtime, but don't panic. This happens quite frequently to the East Coast viewers. Check your TV schedule.


From B-H blog: http://cs.bloodhorse.com/blogs/ntra-alex-waldrop-straight-up/archive/2010/10/26/zenyatta-a-hit-with-old-and-new-media.aspx

>And perhaps most notable of all, CBS News’ award-winning TV news magazine program “60 Minutes” will devote one of its main segments to Zenyatta this Sunday evening, October 31. The correspondent for the Zenyatta segment will be 26-time Emmy award winning journalist, Bob Simon, who spent a considerable amount of time with Zenyatta. Not bad company for a 6-year-old from California. With an audience that regularly swells to 15 million viewers, 60 Minutes will introduce Zenyatta to yet another new audience of potential horseracing fans.<

[Wando]

Probably a bit of a silly post, but for what it's worth I had a dream last night that Zenyatta won the Classic by 2 lengths.

I don't often dream of racing and when I do I rarely see who the specific horses are. The last time I had such a vivid dream, it was prior to Wando winning the Queens Plate. In my dream (which started at the top of the stretch), Wando had the lead and widened to win by about 15 lengths.

In the dream I had last night, which was also as they turned into the stretch, Zenyatta made her move early, like she has done in her two previous dirt races and had the lead shortly after turning for home. She opened up a 4 length lead and coasted home winning by 2 under a hand ride. I don't know who finished 2nd or 3rd because I was only focused on Zenyatta. Also the track was fast.

Hopefully that is a good sign and I haven't jinxed her. :becky:

[Songofthesword]

http://www.horseracing.com/blog/20-and-done-means-no-1

[Blue Jeans]

http://www.horseracing.com/blog/20-and-done-means-no-1

Never mind, I can't get past this ....
>You know what they say about opinions… Well here's mine. To me, the two hardest things in racing are to watch a female rider ride a horse I've wagered on, and the other is trying to compare horses from different eras. The former, is something I'll never be comfortable with. The latter, I'll take a stab at.<

Besides, I'm in a hurry.

[islandgirl45]

Bloodhorse is doing a commemorative issue on Zenyatta. Don't know if someone is interested in this, so I thought I'd post it here......

A Tribute to Thoroughbred Racing’s Queen Starting with her first stakes victory, Zenyatta's incredible racing career will be chronicled by The Blood-Horse writers and photographers. This special commemorative issue (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bbx178943&) will profile owners Jerry and Ann Moss, trainer John Shirreffs, and other key personnel and includes dozens of photographs of Zenyatta in all her glory.

The special edition, sponsored by War Horse Place, will be bound into the November 20 issue of The Blood-Horse, making it FREE for subscribers. Or, order the Zenyatta Commemorative Collector's Issue (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bcx178943&) as a seperate edition and get a FREE 8x10 photo of the cover shot. The special issue will be available after this year’s Breeders’ Cup Classic, but we're accepting orders now.
Celebrate the journey of this undefeated sensation with the Zenyatta Commemorative Collector's Issue (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bdx178943&) and photo from The Blood-Horse.
Click here (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bex178943&) to reserve your copy.
Order by phone 800.582.5604

http://www.bloodhorse.com/ecards/images/ZENYATTA_Special.jpg (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bfx178943&)
Zenyatta Commemorative
Collector’s Issue • 56 pages
Only $9.95 plus
FREE SHIPPING*

[Secretariat Forever]

^ awesome!!

[Man o' Taz]

Bloodhorse is doing a commemorative issue on Zenyatta. Don't know if someone is interested in this, so I thought I'd post it here......

A Tribute to Thoroughbred Racing’s Queen Starting with her first stakes victory, Zenyatta's incredible racing career will be chronicled by The Blood-Horse writers and photographers. This special commemorative issue (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bbx178943&) will profile owners Jerry and Ann Moss, trainer John Shirreffs, and other key personnel and includes dozens of photographs of Zenyatta in all her glory.

The special edition, sponsored by War Horse Place, will be bound into the November 20 issue of The Blood-Horse, making it FREE for subscribers. Or, order the Zenyatta Commemorative Collector's Issue (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bcx178943&) as a seperate edition and get a FREE 8x10 photo of the cover shot. The special issue will be available after this year’s Breeders’ Cup Classic, but we're accepting orders now.
Celebrate the journey of this undefeated sensation with the Zenyatta Commemorative Collector's Issue (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bdx178943&) and photo from The Blood-Horse.
Click here (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bex178943&) to reserve your copy.
Order by phone 800.582.5604

http://www.bloodhorse.com/ecards/images/ZENYATTA_Special.jpg (http://maestro-trk.bloodhorse.com/trk/click?ref=zqoqmnmb8_1-2059x3126bfx178943&)
Zenyatta Commemorative
Collector’s Issue • 56 pages
Only $9.95 plus
FREE SHIPPING*


Done... :)

[Izvestia]

I ordered one as well, but $20.00 shipping to Canada? Ouch. I'm already nervous about the BC Classic. If she wins, the feeling I'll have will be like nothing I've had before in my 20 years of watching racing.

[Retrospectiv]

I ordered one as well, but $20.00 shipping to Canada? Ouch. I'm already nervous about the BC Classic. If she wins, the feeling I'll have will be like nothing I've had before in my 20 years of watching racing.

That's why I won't buy from the BH. Shipping a magazine to Canada costs about $6 tops. They overcharge and make no bones about it.

[second_glance]

Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm

[Izvestia]

That's why I won't buy from the BH. Shipping a magazine to Canada costs about $6 tops. They overcharge and make no bones about it.

I know..but I mean how else am I to get it? Well, maybe Ebay after but then I'm sure they'll jack the price, especially if she wins. It took me like 4 minutes to verify the order after I saw that. ;P

[PONYRCR]

Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm


My favorite part..."(Even now, Moss won't commit to retiring Zenyatta after the Breeders' Cup.)"

[Reposmoral]

Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm

What a fantastic article!

Tears in my eyes!

[The Tin Man]

Some great excerpts from Smith and Moss out of the aforementioned SI article ...

In Arkansas, Smith rode Zenyatta to a going-away 4½-length trouncing of reigning champion older female Ginger Punch, and he has been on her back for each of her subsequent wins, including both Breeders' Cup victories. "She's not even a once-in-a-lifetime horse," says Smith. "She's a once-in-several-lifetimes horse. You just don't see a horse like this. Maybe Secretariat or something."

When Zenyatta was four, Moss was inundated with offers to sell her. The bidding reached $5 million, and then, as Moss recalls, "people just started saying, 'What will it take?'" There was no number. "We're here on this earth for a certain amount of time," says Moss. "You sell her, and then you've got a bundle of money but no horse."

Now they have not just any horse, but a transcendent one. "She has a deep heart girth," says Shirreffs, "which indicates plenty of room for lung in her rib cage. But her chest isn't broad, which would inhibit her stride by putting her forelegs farther apart. Behind, she's very strong, when often a horse of her [height] would be narrow in back. The combination, her front and her back, it's amazing. And her heart, who knows how big her heart is. Whatever it is physically, it's huge metaphysically." Zenyatta is also uncommonly sweet at rest; Shirreffs allows fans to visit her almost without restriction.

[The Tin Man]

My favorite part..."(Even now, Moss won't commit to retiring Zenyatta after the Breeders' Cup.)"

I hope she retires after The Cup ... I want her to live a long and healthy life. I wouldn't press it past this next race. I don't think they will either ... At least I hope they won't.

[Ezariah]

My first thought was 3/8, so I should have went with that. I spend at least one morning there on every trip, but never really tried to figure out the size, and never asked anyone either. lol Thanks for the clarification. :)


it's a half mile track and she was on it sunday. you are correct, no "workouts" allowed, at least that's what the sign says :).

technically, for those that are curious, the sign reads "horses are not allowed to work on the training track".

[Blue Jeans]

I hope she retires after The Cup ... I want her to live a long and healthy life. I wouldn't press it past this next race. I don't think they will either ... At least I hope they won't.

Same here!

Tin Man, did you get that one-on-one visit with Zenyatta? And, if so, did you tell "Z" ol' Blue Jeans loves her? Hope so!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0miWfL-_24 ... still my fav "short" video of Zenyatta.

We've lost so many in the threads that were recently lost. :Cry:

[Ezariah]

Shug's comment says a lot, at least to me.
‎"She already deserves to be mentioned in the same breath as any great horse in history," says Hall of Fame trainer Shug McGaughey


Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm

[Hermes]

Shug's comment says a lot, at least to me.
‎"She already deserves to be mentioned in the same breath as any great horse in history," says Hall of Fame trainer Shug McGaughey

Thanks for posting that. Spectacular article. I think Tim Layden is as good as any writer that covers the sport of racing, and I wish he wrote about it more often.

[WestCoast]

My first thought was 3/8, so I should have went with that. I spend at least one morning there on every trip, but never really tried to figure out the size, and never asked anyone either. lol Thanks for the clarification. :)

I actually giggled out loud at the thought of Zen working on the training track. I pictured her taking the turn, and Mike having to counter-steer into it like a race car driver. Also, Mike was going "Errrr Reeeeee ARRRRRR!" like squealing tires.

[islandgirl45]

Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm

A beautifully written piece. Possibly the best article I've read about Zenyatta and her connections.

The discussion of Zenyatta needing to mature physically before she could run makes one shudder to think what could have happened to her if she had been purchased by a less patient trainer and owner.

In regard to the sentence, (Even now, Moss won't commit to retiring Zenyatta after the Breeders' Cup), I confess I would love to see her try the Dubai World Cup as her last race if she looked like she still wanted to race early next year. However, I realize that's unlikely.;)

[Commentator]

Tim Layden is amazing. Football, horse racing, whatever he writes is pure quality.

That article gave me goosebumps. Thanks for posting it!

[Ezariah]

Love that visual WC! :becky:


I actually giggled out loud at the thought of Zen working on the training track. I pictured her taking the turn, and Mike having to counter-steer into it like a race car driver. Also, Mike was going "Errrr Reeeeee ARRRRRR!" like squealing tires.

[Ezariah]

Totally agree with you Hermes - great article! I rarely do this, but I intend to print this one out.


Thanks for posting that. Spectacular article. I think Tim Layden is as good as any writer that covers the sport of racing, and I wish he wrote about it more often.

[islandgirl45]

Zenyatta, Goldikova Steal BC Headlines
By Steve Haskin (http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/author/steve-haskin)
http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/59537/zenyatta-goldikova-steal-bc-headlines

Excerpt:
Bob Baffert, who will send out Lookin At Lucky against Zenyatta in the Classic, is a big admirer of both mares.

“If Goldikova wins this race for the third time, she’s amazing," he said. "She’s been overshadowed by Zenyatta and has gotten a little lost, but she has to placed right up there with her.

“I’ve been fortunate enough to watch Zenyatta run in her races here in California. She’s such a smart mare. She knows where the wire is. It’s almost like a game to her. She’s like a killer whale playing with the seals. I get goosebumps just watching her run. Once she passes you in the stretch you start rooting for her. She means that much to everybody.”


Gotta love that visual.:)

[Valiant-Nature]

Totally agree with you Hermes - great article! I rarely do this, but I intend to print this one out.

I miss Hunter Thompson. Now there was a gambling addicts horseracing writer.

[Man o' Taz]

Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm

Great story title...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwNYPxkwFaA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62gXu5GHMak&feature=related

Zenyatta (She's the One =- Springsteen)

With her killer races and her final kick's paces
That no colt can fill with your hand on her reins
Oh and that smile in her eyes
Because she knows that it kills me
With her mane flying in the breeze
Standing in that stall door like a dream
I wish she'd ne'r leave me alone
Because french cream won't soften this jock's boots
And dirt tracks will not break those hooves of stone
With her long tail flying
And her coat that shines like a midnight sun
Oh-o she's the one, she's the one

That Thunder in your heart
At night when you're grazing in the dark
It says you're never gonna leave her
But there's this angel in her eyes
That tells no desperate lies
And all you want to do is believe her
And tonight you'll try just one more time
To leave it all behind and to break on through
Oh she can take you, but if she wants to break you
She's gonna find out that ain't so easy to do
And no matter where you ride tonight or how far you run
Oh-o she's the one, she's the one

Oh-o and just one more glimpse
Would fill them long winter nights
With this special miss that special gait you dance
Just one more win perchance and it will all end in bliss
Oh she's the one, oh she's the one
Oh she's the one, oh she's the one
Oh she's the one, oh she's the one
Zenyatta, she's the one!

[Secretariat Forever]

My favorite part..."(Even now, Moss won't commit to retiring Zenyatta after the Breeders' Cup.)"


I was going to post the same thing. I thought they were all commited to retiring her after the BC. Hmm...I guess it's really going to be up to Zenyatta.


Definitely one of the best articles I've read about her. Probably the best. So in depth.

[Commentator]

Oh man, it just occurred to me... I wonder what Jason Shandler has to say about Zenyatta only pre-entering the Classic. He was so insistent that she would be cross-entered. Even to her own connections. Oops.

[Hermes]

Oh man, it just occurred to me... I wonder what Jason Shandler has to say about Zenyatta only pre-entering the Classic. He was so insistent that she would be cross-entered. Even to her own connections. Oops.

Ha. I forgot that as I discount so much of what he writes. Bet he won't blog on that.

[Happy Endings]

Story in the 11/1 Sports Illustrated: "She's the One". Available online:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1176387/1/index.htm

Thanks for that link. Thoroughly enjoyed the read!

[Happy Endings]

Oh man, it just occurred to me... I wonder what Jason Shandler has to say about Zenyatta only pre-entering the Classic. He was so insistent that she would be cross-entered. Even to her own connections. Oops.

I never pay any attention to anything he has to say.

[Secretariat Forever]

Update for today.

http://www.zenyatta2010.com/


"She's just galloped so well the last couple of days," said trainer John Shirreffs. "She's really stepped up her game."

[Commentator]

Hs. I forgot that as I discount so much of what he writes. Bet he won't blog on that.
Haha I only go to his blog when I feel like raising my blood pressure. If he does write about it, I can almost guarantee that it will involve something like "they must be banking on the fact that it won't rain on Saturday" or "they may regret this if the track comes up wet." I guess everybody needs something to believe in...

Anyways, back to discussing real writers. That Layden article has me so excited for the BC. I was still kind of nervous about my whole insane last-minute BC trip thing, but he really drove it home: she is history. And as a racing fan, win or lose, I want to witness that history.

[Uh-oh Bango]

I never pay any attention to anything he has to say.

Sometimes, Jason Shandler can be an a$$

[Hermes]

Haha I only go to his blog when I feel like raising my blood pressure. If he does write about it, I can almost guarantee that it will involve something like "they must be banking on the fact that it won't rain on Saturday" or "they may regret this if the track comes up wet." I guess everybody needs something to believe in...

Anyways, back to discussing real writers. That Layden article has me so excited for the BC. I was still kind of nervous about my whole insane last-minute BC trip thing, but he really drove it home: she is history. And as a racing fan, win or lose, I want to witness that history.

I think it is awesome that you are going. Look at it this way, you won't regret going, but you will regret not going.

[Dave in TJMex]

Haha I only go to his blog when I feel like raising my blood pressure. If he does write about it, I can almost guarantee that it will involve something like "they must be banking on the fact that it won't rain on Saturday" or "they may regret this if the track comes up wet." I guess everybody needs something to believe in...

Anyways, back to discussing real writers. That Layden article has me so excited for the BC. I was still kind of nervous about my whole insane last-minute BC trip thing, but he really drove it home: she is history. And as a racing fan, win or lose, I want to witness that history.

Hermes is exactly right when she says you will only regret it if you DON'T go on this trip. You will remember this trip to the BCC forever.

Have fun, Commentator! :target:

[Ezariah]

That's exactly what I tell people when they say they're not sure if they should go or not.


I think it is awesome that you are going. Look at it this way, you won't regret going, but you will regret not going.

[Dave in TJMex]

By the way, Commentator, I'll bet I speak for a lot of Z fans when I say that those of us who were at the BCC last year at Santa Anita will never forget the feeling we had when Zenyatta roared down the stretch to win. It was a peak "horse racing" moment for me.

And as Trevor said, a "performance we'll never forget."

Win or lose, I bet you will always remember your BCC trip to Louisville with lots of fond memories. :)

[Hermes]

I heard that about SA, and from some pretty jaded folks. No one wanted to leave.

If she wins this year, that place will flood with tears, of joy. And 10 years from now, the number of people that said they were there will be 150,000:)

[Commentator]

You're all entirely correct, of course! I can only imagine what it was like at Santa Anita last year. And hopefully, two weeks from now I won't have to imagine it at all :)

..and now I'm even more excited!

[Dave in TJMex]

You're all entirely correct, of course! I can only imagine what it was like at Santa Anita last year. And hopefully, two weeks from now I won't have to imagine it at all :)

..and now I'm even more excited!

Start packing! Gas up the car!

Its never too soon to leave for L-ville! :hat:

[Ezariah]

So true Dave. I wouldn't miss this for anything!


Win or lose, I bet you will always remember your BCC trip to Louisville with lots of fond memories. :)


No doubt about that Hermes!


If she wins this year, that place will flood with tears, of joy. And 10 years from now, the number of people that said they were there will be 150,000:)

[Dusty]

You're all entirely correct, of course! I can only imagine what it was like at Santa Anita last year. And hopefully, two weeks from now I won't have to imagine it at all :)

..and now I'm even more excited!

I was there (SA)and I still cannot believe the experience = have a great time and ENJOY! I only wish I could be there!

[PJMIII]

Nice article by Jennie Rees.

Zenyatta brightest star in a big Breeders' Cup galaxy

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20101027/SPORTS08/310270096/1037/Zenyatta+brightest+star+in+a+big+Breeders++Cup+gal axy

[WestCoast]

I was there (SA)and I still cannot believe the experience = have a great time and ENJOY! I only wish I could be there!

I was there and will never, ever forget the electricity in the air. No other day has ever come close in excitement, and I've been to several BCs, a few Derbies, a Preakness, two Belmonts, the All American Futurity, etc. etc.

No comparison.

[Valiant-Nature]

I was there and will never, ever forget the electricity in the air. No other day has ever come close in excitement, and I've been to several BCs, a few Derbies, a Preakness, two Belmonts, the All American Futurity, etc. etc.

No comparison.

I would never have guessed the BC last year to be more exciting and electric than the All American Futurity.

And why is it that nobody ever mentions '08 for excitement, even though she ran in the same plant for her Distaff and was of course undefeated? Nobody ever talks about it being electric in '08. I thought it was pretty electric.

[Diver52]

Yep, it was an incredible high last year. The BC gift shops were jammed after the races--everyone wanted sometihing, it didn't even have to be Zenyatta oriented. (I got the "program shirt" and added a big felt-pen check mark by Number 4.)

[WestCoast]

I would never have guessed the BC last year to be more exciting and electric than the All American Futurity.

And why is it that nobody ever mentions '08 for excitement, even though she ran in the same plant for her Distaff and was of course undefeated? Nobody ever talks about it being electric in '08. I thought it was pretty electric.

Your sarcasm re: the All American is noted. Never mind that it's the Derby of QH racing... I was merely pointing out I've been to many "big" races and have adequate means to compare.

I was at the '08 BC as well, and was already an ardent fan of Z at that point. However, the rest of the world hadn't caught on just yet. It was an exciting race, but obviously a mare wins the Distaff every year. What Zen did in the Classic was much, much bigger. Putting them together is just icing on a delicious cake.

In actual Zenyatta news...

She galloped on the main track this morning and looked... out of this world. It's hard for me to imagine her looking better, but logic tells me John is still tightening the screws. She's going to be scary.

[Valiant-Nature]

Your sarcasm re: the All American is noted. Never mind that it's the Derby of QH racing... I was merely pointing out I've been to many "big" races and have adequate means to compare.

I was at the '08 BC as well, and was already an ardent fan of Z at that point. However, the rest of the world hadn't caught on just yet. It was an exciting race, but obviously a mare wins the Distaff every year. What Zen did in the Classic was much, much bigger. Putting them together is just icing on a delicious cake.

In actual Zenyatta news...

She galloped on the main track this morning and looked... out of this world. It's hard for me to imagine her looking better, but logic tells me John is still tightening the screws. She's going to be scary.

Yes, I am aware of the Futurity's place in QH racing.

So, 19-0 and giving it a go on dirt at America's premier and historic racetrack, against the best of the best on dirt and at distance, and it's the last time she'll race; This has to be the most electric atmosphere by a country mile? Yes?

[second_glance]

Short preview clip of the 60 Minutes piece.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7000239n&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+CBSNewsVideo+%28News+Video%3A +CBSNews.com%29&utm_content=Twitter

I very much like Bob Simon, so I may have to watch it after all. :evil:

[EquineAnne]

Short preview clip of the 60 Minutes piece.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7000239n&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+CBSNewsVideo+%28News+Video%3A +CBSNews.com%29&utm_content=Twitter

I very much like Bob Simon, so I may have to watch it after all. :evil:

Mikey's words will not make everyone happy.

[WestCoast]

Yes, I am aware of the Futurity's place in QH racing.

So, 19-0 and giving it a go on dirt at America's premier and historic racetrack, against the best of the best on dirt and at distance, and it's the last time she'll race; This has to be the most electric atmosphere by a country mile? Yes?

I'm unsure why I'm being called out on something I would never disagree with.

[StarGirl11]

Mikey's words will not make everyone happy.

What did he say? I don't have access to videos to blockage here.

[WestCoast]

What did he say? I don't have access to videos to blockage here.

Basically, that she's better than Secretariat.

[DesertHeat]

Or would be, if she goes 20 - 0

ETA - I'm not saying this is my opinion, I'm saying that's what Mike says in the 60 Min interview clip

[GreenasGrass]

I read it as him saying she's Secretariat to him, and that's perfectly acceptable. I didn't see any attempt to draw comparisons between the two horses.

[Reposmoral]

Just that (basically) she's the best horse he's ever ridden, and if she goes down 20-0 in the Classic then she deserves to go down as one of the best ever, if not the best, mentioned in the same breath as Secretariat. He admits he's biased, his belief is that you can't argue with perfection--this was all assuming she wins the Classic. That's his opinion and he's welcome to it. Bear in mind, the interviewer put Secretariat in the conversation. Mike said, "...she'd be one of the best ever." and he said, "Better than Secretariat?" That's when he pulled out the "its hard to argue with perfection" line.

I don't find any of that ridiculous or especially controversial. If she goes 20-0 in the Classic *I* will certainly consider her one of the best ever, and she certainly gets mentioned in the same breath as Secretariat for ME, simply because of the way both horses make me feel when I want their races. It's the same feeling of awe, joy, tears, and the sense of experiencing what I can best call an art form.

I don't know which would beat the other in a race, and think it's pointless to ask. When I compare the two, I'm comparing that gut feeling, that core emotional reaction to what I'm witnessing.

[DesertHeat]

Just that (basically) she's the best horse he's ever ridden, and if she goes down 20-0 in the Classic then she deserves to go down as one of the best ever, if not the best, mentioned in the same breath as Secretariat. He admits he's biased, his belief is that you can't argue with perfection--this was all assuming she wins the Classic. That's his opinion and he's welcome to it. Bear in mind, the interviewer put Secretariat in the conversation. Mike said, "...she'd be one of the best ever." and he said, "Better than Secretariat?" That's when he pulled out the "its hard to argue with perfection" line.

I don't find any of that ridiculous or especially controversial. If she goes 20-0 in the Classic *I* will certainly consider her one of the best ever, and she certainly gets mentioned in the same breath as Secretariat for ME, simply because of the way both horses make me feel when I want their races. It's the same feeling of awe, joy, tears, and the sense of experiencing what I can best call an art form.

I don't know which would beat the other in a race, and think it's pointless to ask. When I compare the two, I'm comparing that gut feeling, that core emotional reaction to what I'm witnessing.

I love this post :-)

[Allspice]

What did he say? I don't have access to videos to blockage here.

He said (to him) she is one of the greatest of all time, and if she win the Classic again, she is the greatest of all time. Basically.

ETA:
"...I think she could arguably go down as one of the greatest, if not the greatest horse of all time. And if she pulls this off...(to me) she could be the greatest horse of all time."

[The Tin Man]

He said (to him) she is one of the greatest of all time, and if she win the Classic again, she is the greatest of all time. Basically.

ETA:
"...I think she could arguably go down as one of the greatest, if not the greatest horse of all time. And if she pulls this off...(to me) she could be the greatest horse of all time."

Key point for everybody to note here is that he said "could be" ...

I personally already consider her an all-time great. MAYBE the greatest female of all-time ... If she wins The Classic again ... I'll take off the "maybe" and just consider her THE greatest FEMALE of all-time.

[Hermes]

Mike has said this before and it is not news, and nothing he said should offend anyone. And this is from someone who thinks Secretariat stands alone.

If she goes 20 and 0 with two BCC's it is damn hard not to put her right up there, and Mike is her jock and clearly in love with her.

The clip is meant to hook viewers.