CHRB Steward Minutes

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serenassong
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Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:54 am

I thought that I would start this thread (had a similar one before the big crash) with some interesting notes from the minutes- good or bad- that perhaps others would like to see. Some of them can be quite comical- can remember in the old thread that there was a car or some type of vehicle parked to close to the starting gate and the notes read something like "some idiot parked too close to the gate and there was a delay until the party was located".

With that being said- this is a bit concerning- SA minutes:
"6-14-142 ALONSO QUINONEZ RULING – LATS #206
Jockey ALONSO QUINONEZ is fined THREE HUNDRED DOLLARS ($300.00)* for violation of California Horse Racing Board rule #1688(b) (Use of Whips – caused a welt) during the eighth race at Santa Anita Park on May 24, 2014.
This ruling was issued after Mr. Quinonez viewed video and photographs of the horse “Warren’s Assassin, which he rode to a win on May 24, 2014. The horse was observed to have a large welt and blood on its right flank. After seeing the photos and looking at the video, Mr. Quinonez acknowledged his guilt. He said that he would be more cognizant of where he hits his mounts in the future."

None deaths reported for the report on ending 6-14, which is always a good thing.

Report ending 6/21- good work by all involved:
"06/15/143 RACE DELAY-NINTH RACE
There was a 13 minute delay in this race when #4 QUEEN KALYRRA unseated her rider, ran off and fell over the inside rail of the main course while warming up for a turf race. The horse was stuck between the outside turf rail and main course inside rail. With the help of Track Veterinarian DANA STEAD, Outrider JESUS CAMACHO and Santa Anita’s maintenance crew, the horse was removed from that area with a shallow laceration to her shoulder and traveled in the horse ambulance back to her stable. The jockey, ELVIS TRUJILLO, was not injured."

Someone doesn't want to race....
"06/19/142 INQUIRY - NO CHANGE - SEVENTH RACE (one mile turf)
Following the running of the race, the Inquiry was posted to review the start of the race. Involved was #1 PUBLIC INTEREST (Tr. J. Shirreffs) who chose not to leave the gate when the field was dispatched. After a review of the race and conversation with Starter JAY SLENDER, it was a unanimous decision to declare the horse a starter. It took about 20 seconds to remove the horse from the gate, to allow the gate to be removed from the track so the race could be completed. The horse refused to walk out the front and had to be backed out. PUBLIC INTEREST also refused in its career start. Starter Slender has placed the horse on the Starter’s List; it will not be allowed to race in California."
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BaroqueAgain1
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Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:25 pm

Sure sounds like Public Interest has cast his vote for a different career.
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Diver52
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Wed Jun 25, 2014 4:44 pm

For once, the stewards are acting in the public interest. . . .

I know, that's too obvious. :D
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peeptoad
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Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:42 am

serenassong wrote: Someone doesn't want to race....
"06/19/142 INQUIRY - NO CHANGE - SEVENTH RACE (one mile turf)
Following the running of the race, the Inquiry was posted to review the start of the race. Involved was #1 PUBLIC INTEREST (Tr. J. Shirreffs) who chose not to leave the gate when the field was dispatched. After a review of the race and conversation with Starter JAY SLENDER, it was a unanimous decision to declare the horse a starter. It took about 20 seconds to remove the horse from the gate, to allow the gate to be removed from the track so the race could be completed. The horse refused to walk out the front and had to be backed out. PUBLIC INTEREST also refused in its career start. Starter Slender has placed the horse on the Starter’s List; it will not be allowed to race in California."
Ha ha. I saw that debut race of Public Interest's... and added him to my VS when he wouldn't break. I just wanted to see if that happened again. It took awhile...(that debut was in January 2013), but he did it again. ;)
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Thu Jun 26, 2014 10:54 am

peeptoad wrote:Ha ha. I saw that debut race of Public Interest's... and added him to my VS when he wouldn't break. I just wanted to see if that happened again. It took awhile...(that debut was in January 2013), but he did it again. ;)
Slightly off topic, but look up Tapativity's race record. Those DNFs aren't because he got hurt, they're because he never left the gate. And even when he did decide to break, he'd walk out of the gate lengths behind everyone else. Needless to say he's been retired now, probably in no small part because no one will let him run at their track due to his gate antics :lol:
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serenassong
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Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:16 am

SA notes- closing week

Things that make you go hmmm-
"06/27/141 DESORMEAUX MEETING
We held an informal meeting with jockey KENT DESORMEAUX to discuss the circumstances under which he was removed from his two mounts yesterday. We are requiring Mr. Desormeaux to submit to a breathalyzer each day before he rides and referred the matter to the CHRB for investigation."

Wardrobe Malfunction-
"06/29/141 FILM REVIEW
Jockey COREY NAKATANI came to the office as directed to discuss a few issues. We reviewed his ride in the fourth race yesterday which seemed odd but upon closer review, his mount was quite difficult to handle. We also discussed why he was late to the paddock for that same race. Apparently there was a zipper issue on his silks which was broken and it took time to find a replacement set."

Not today -
"06/29/147 FLORES MEETING
Jockey ESWAN FLORES came to the office to explain his erratic behavior the last two days. On the first day, he said after learning that he had missed the deadline for calling in to be late, he decided he really didn’t want to ride so didn’t come to the track. On the second day, he explained that he thought he had told our secretary that he was sick and taking off but that was inconsistent with our secretary’s story. Then he explained that although he was ordered to test yesterday, he thought it would be okay to just do it today. We ordered him to test and explained that he would be off mounts until the test results were in or we held a formal hearing into this incident."

Pulled a "Public Interest" (see previous post)- but better results.
"06/29/148 INQUIRY/NO CHANGE
Following the running of the fourth race, we posted the inquiry sign to examine an incident at the starting gate. Films revealed that although the gates opened properly and the assistant starter acted appropriately, #2 A C’S CRACKERJACK (A. Gryder. T. Proctor, trainer) refused to move. After a few seconds and some encouragement, the horse left the gates and eventually completed the race. No change was the unanimous decision and the horse was declared a starter."
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serenassong
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Wed Jul 02, 2014 9:44 am

Week ending 6/22- Oak Tree meeting at Pleasanton (Alameda County Fair)

Improvements made -
"The lower-level trackside apron has been entirely resurfaced. The winner’s circle enclosure has been enlarged and beautified. The director’s room, on the way to the judge’s stand, has been enlarged in addition to new furniture, carpeting, artwork and resurfaced/remodeled food and beverage areas. In order for this enlargement to take place the Pleasanton press box has been removed. The timer operator, Equibase personnel and newspaper reporters will now work from an open air restricted area in the grandstand."

The Sounds of Pimlico-
"Thursday
06-19-141 ANNOUNCER REPLACEMENT
Dave Rodman, who is the regular announcer at Pimlico Racetrack in Maryland, is serving as track announcer here at Pleasanton for the first six (6) racing days. Rodman is filling in for Frank Mirahmadi while Frank fills in for Trevor Denman at Santa Anita Park in Arcadia."

Speedy recovery, Tony-
"06-19-144 MORNING ACCIDENT
Assistant Starter Tony Garcia was involved in an incident at the starting gate during morning training hours today. Garcia was kicked hard and was reported to have broken some ribs while attempting to school a horse. It was reported that Garcia will spend the night at a local hospital for observation."

FYI -
"06-22-144 CESAR NUNGARAY-GUZMAN (CASE NO. 14GG0043)
A formal hearing was held today at the Alameda County Fair in Pleasanton. Veterinarian Assistant/Owner Cesar Nungaray-Guzman was charged with alleged violation of California Horse Racing Board Rule #1489 (Grounds for Denial or Refusal of License). On the day of the hearing this complaint was amended to add CHRB Rule #1900 (Grounds for Suspension or Revocation), Rule #1902.5 (Animal Welfare) and Rule #1902 (Conduct Detrimental to Horse Racing).
The complaint reads as follows, “Nungaray-Guzman was convicted in Contra Costa County Superior Court of PC 597 (b) – Animal Cruelty. He is on probation for three years and cannot own animals.”
Along with the stewards present at today’s meeting were Veterinarian Assistant/Owner Cesar Nungaray-Guzman, CHRB Investigator Dan Dailey (Supervisor – North), and Contra
Costa County and Animal Control Services Sergeant Terry DeCosta. Christine Niccoli (Certified Court Reporter) transcribed the proceedings.
On April 18, 2012 Contra Costa County Animal Control was contacted by a concerned citizen who was horseback riding in the Richmond/El Sobrante Hills in the East Bay. Four (4) horses were soon seized by Animal Control. Pictures at today’s hearing showed obvious signs of malnourishment and/or rain rot that were found on these horses who were on a small ranch in these hills.
Guzman had been working for three (3) veterinarians at Golden Gate Fields as a veterinarian assistant. Guzman stated he was given most of the approximately eight (8) horses at the East Bay ranch that was owned by another individual. He purchased at least one (1) of these horses. He stated that his intent was to “help” these horses, who had problems, but he got too many of them and he couldn’t keep up with the cost of their upkeep.
At the live hearing Sergeant DeCosta said Contra Costa County spent $35,000 on veterinarian and boarding bills on the four (4) horses that were seized in order to rehabilitate these horses. Three (3) years probation and full restitution was the sentence for the one (1) misdemeanor conviction of PC 597 (b) – Animal Cruelty. Four (4) felony counts were originally filed in this matter. Guzman pled ‘no contest’ to the one (1) misdemeanor.
On April 23, 2014 CHRB Executive Director Rick Baedeker summarily suspended Guzman’s CHRB license. After this date Guzman traveled to Santa Anita Park to apply for a groom’s license at which time he was denied by CHRB enforcement.
The stewards will review all documents presented at the hearing. They will also consider all testimony given. A decision on the case will be made in the near future. More to follow."


As a note, they have been having some timing and tote board issues- both are being looked into and addressed. Seems to happen sporadically.
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serenassong
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Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:16 pm

Oak Tree @ Pleasanton - 6/29

If anyone was looking for info on this one- will have to double check to see if this one is on the vets list-
"06-26-147 RACE #2 – ACCIDENT / DELAY
During the loading process for the 2nd race #1 THE PAPERBOY became fractious in the starting gate and flipped over. Jockey Martin Arriaga was unable to extract himself and was momentarily hung up in the gate before the assistant starter pulled him clear of the horse. There was a delay of the start until Mr. Arriaga was examined by the medical staff and the ambulance was back in position. Early reports were that the horse escaped injury other than scrapes and bruises and the rider was sent to the hospital for further examination with a possible leg injury. (See accident report)."

Ruling on case- see previous post
"06-27-143 RULING NO. 4 – OWNER/VETERINARIAN ASSISTANT CESAR NUNGARAY-GUZMAN (REF: 06-22-144)
Owner/Veterinarian Assistant CESAR NUNGARAY-GUZMAN is suspended for the term of his license 03/20/15 AND 03/20/14 EXP. for violation of California Horse Racing Board rules #1489 (Grounds for Denial or Refusal of License), #1902.5 (Animal Welfare) and #1902 (b) (Conduct Detrimental to Racing) having been convicted in Contra Costa County on 3/21/14 of PC 597 (b) – Animal Cruelty.
Further it is recommended that CESAR NUNGARAY-GUZMAN be denied any future licensing by the California Horse Racing Board.
During the term of suspension all license and license privileges of Owner/Veterinarian Assistant CESAR NUNGARAY-GUZMAN shall remain suspended and pursuant to California Horse Racing Board rule #1528 (Jurisdiction of Stewards), subject is denied access to all premises in this jurisdiction.
The foregoing ruling was issued after this Board gave the matter its due deliberation following a review of the evidence present at the hearing."

Better late than never I guess- peaked my interest because this is a Harlington-

"06-27-144 RULING NO. 5 – SHAUN CHRISTOPHER MORROW
Acting on an order of remand dated June 19, 2014 with California Horse Racing Board, Trainer SHAUN CHRISTOPHER MORROW, who started the horse CHARLSIE’S SONG, second place finisher in the fourth race at the Fresno District Fair on October 5, 2013 is suspended thirty (30) days, fined one thousand five hundred dollars ($1,500)* and placed on probation for one year from the date of this ruling pursuant to C.H.R.B. rule #1887 (a) (Trainer to Insure Condition of Horse) for violation of C.H.R.B. rule #1843 (a) and (d) (Medication, Drugs and Other Substances – Clenbuterol – [Class III]).
For cause, fifteen days of the thirty day suspension are stayed provided Mr. Morrow is not in violation of C.H.R.B. Rules and Regulations #1843 and #1877 regarding class III drug substances during the term of probation. If Mr. Morrow violates a condition of his probation the above reference fifteen (15) day stay of suspension shall be lifted and the remaining suspensions shall be imposed after notice and hearing. The fifteen (15) day suspension shall be served from July 5, 2014 through July 19, 2014 inclusive.
During the term of suspension all licenses and license privileges of trainer SHAUN C. MORROW are suspended and pursuant to C.H.R.B. rule #1528 (Jurisdiction of Stewards), subject is denied access to all premises in this jurisdiction."
The preceding ruling was issued after the stewards informed Mr. Morrow of the CHRB Board’s decision. Mr. Morrow was given a few days before the ruling was set to start to allow him the opportunity to arrange care for his horses."
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serenassong
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Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:31 pm

Oak Tree @ Pleasanton-7/3

Close call for Vic- glad he is ok-
"07-03-142 SAFETY STEWARD CONCERN
Safety Steward Vic Stauffer came to the steward’s office and was advised to consider filing a complaint with the CHRB concerning almost being hit by a track water truck following the last race on Sunday. Details of the incident were omitted in our conversation due to the possibility of a future hearing."

Could have been worse-
"07-03-145 ROBERTS HEARING – CASE #14GG0063
A complaint was heard concerning an argument between trainer Don Roberts and exercise rider Ronald Glover which was observed by CHRB Investigator Louis Quesada. Although no physical assaults were observed or reported, Mr. Roberts was armed with a golf club. Testimony was taken and a decision to follow."
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serenassong
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Fri Jul 11, 2014 1:41 pm

Los Al- TB/QH meet-

This is upsetting, not sure if a TB or QH- but unacceptable-
"SUNDAY
06/29/2014 (1) VINNIE BEDNAR VISITS
Jockey Vinnie Bednar was in to discuss his failure to dismount after his winning mount pulled up lame. He said he was in a quandary as another horse had broken down, and he did not think two horses could be put in the horse ambulance. We told him that if he is on a mount that is not traveling right, he is to get off and let the proper people worry about removing the horse from the track."
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BaroqueAgain1
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Fri Jul 11, 2014 3:17 pm

I would think that one of the first things a rider learns is to get off a lame/injured horse ASAP. But, in Bednar's case, I guess I would be wrong. :evil:
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serenassong
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Tue Jul 29, 2014 10:41 am

California State Fair- Sacramento - 7/13


True meaning of rail birds
Tues 7/8- "The stewards stand was inspected and in the process of being cleaned. The local bird population had evidently had some members roosting in the stand."

Opps...
"07-13-146 STARTING GATE MISHAP / INQUIRY / NON-STARTER
The stewards posted the Inquiry sign immediately after the start of today’s sixth race going 5 ½ furlongs. The stewards also had track announcer Frank Mirahmadi announce there was a steward’s Inquiry during the running of the race.
At the start of this race #7 DEVIL’S ISSUE (Owner – David Walker; Trainer William Nolan; Jockey Juan Sanchez) was being led by an assistant starter behind the starting gate. This horse had not yet headed into his starting gate stall when the field was dispatched by Starter Todd Stephens. Two (2) of the race contestants broke poorly and/or slowly. They were second place finisher #4 SOUL SAVER (Russell Baze) and fifth place finisher #2 BEERTALK (Pablo Flores). The stewards showed numerous replays of the start. Starter Todd Stephens was spoken to and stated, “I just missed him,” referencing the fact that the entire field of horses was not loaded prior to dispatch. The stewards unanimously felt this situation did not warrant utilizing CHRB rule #1544 (Calling Off Race).
The stewards did, however, implement CHRB rule #1696 (The Start). #7 DEVIL ISSUE was unanimously ordered to be declared a non-starter and Cal Expo Mutuel Manager Bryan Wayte made the appropriate refunds to the public. Appropriate graphic displays were disseminated and Track Announcer Frank Mirahmadi made the proper public address notifications.
Starter Todd Stephens was ordered to see the stewards on Thursday, July 17."
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Life At Zen
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Wed Jul 30, 2014 6:16 pm

At the very least, the horse got the very best schooling session out of it.
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serenassong
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Thu Aug 14, 2014 8:37 am

Link for the W/E 8/9 at Delmar- I am concerned about all the rides being reviewed- although I have not been reading these notes for a long time- it does seem like an awful lot of aggressive riding is going on- more than normal IMO

http://www.chrb.ca.gov/Stewards/Minutes ... _08_09.pdf
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Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:09 pm

8/16 Delmar-
This is interesting- did not know trainer could check the "yes" box like this- must have really wanted the horse-

"CLAIMED HORSE
Trainer Kristin Mulhall, through disqualification, claimed the eventual winner of the first race, #1 ONTOLOGY. While galloping out Ontology’s jockey quickly pulled him up and dismounted. The horse was then vanned off and placed on the Veterinarian list for being unsound. The claim was not voided because the trainer elected to mark the “Yes” box on the back of the claim slip. The “Yes” box indicates, “the claimant elects to claim the horse regardless of whether the Racing or Official Veterinarian determines the horse will be placed on the Veterinarian’s List as unsound or lame.” Therefore, Ms. Mulhall is the new trainer for Ontology."

8/23-
Wont run, protesting trainer of "Masochistic"
"08/21/142 FRANKHAM--CARMODY FORMAL HEARING CASE 14DM018
The CHRB filed a complaint against owners, David Frankham and Brian Carmody for a possible violation of CHRB rules 1629 (Penalty for Late Declaration) and 1698 (Failure to Start and Run). Appearing before the BOS were court reporter Michelle Derieg, representing the CHRB Investigator Jim Hamilton and owners David Frankham in person and Brian Carmody participated by phone. On July 31, 2014 Mr. Frankham and Mr. Carmody refused to run their horse “Smogcutter” against the A. C. Avila trainee “Masochistic” who previously had a post race positive. These owners wanted to protest the fact that Mr. Avila had not been sanctioned for the aforementioned positive.
Mr. Frankham testified that the issue started two days prior to the scratch. He also notified a Steward at that time that he and his partner, Mr. Carmody realized they were competing against A.C. Avila’s trainee “Masochistic”, in protest they did not want to run their horse. Both owners stated they wanted to object on principal. They felt that Mr. Avila’s positive was so “egregious” and they were very frustrated with the system taking 4 ½ months for a hearing, they wanted to make a statement. Decision to follow."

New whip rule-
"08/23/145 WHIP REVIEW
Jockeys, Mike Smith, Joe Talamo, Rafael Bejarano, Tiago Pereira and Guild Representative Darrell Haire all attended a voluntary viewing of a collection of videos the BOS had compiled. Several different races were viewed and discussed pertaining to the new whip rule, which will likely be a house rule before the California Horse Racing Board adopts it. Good results were attained from the discussion and there will be further meetings to try to help implement the new style of whip use."

9/3

Doing things "Artfully"- someone likes that word-
"08/27/141 FILM REVIEW
Jockey COREY NAKATANI came to the office to review his ride in the fifth race on Sunday. Films showed that he finds himself in a tough spot in the stretch with a horse in front of him and a horse on his outside, with no running room. He eased his mount out, making some contact with the horse to his outside (albeit artfully) to make running room. He acknowledged his actions and left with the warning that while this may have been acceptable in years past, it is no longer the standard. Warning.
Jockey KAYLA STRA came to the office to review her ride in the sixth race on August 21, during which several riders were involved in a bumping incident at the head of the stretch. We felt that all contributed to it, and that Ms. Stra specifically, could have backed up a bit more artfully.

Ruling on "Masochistic"- see notes from above-
"08/28/141 FRANKHAM/CARMODY RULING
We issued the following ruling pursuant to the hearing involving owners DAVID FRANKHAM and BRIAN CARMODY and their refusal to run their horse against the connections of “Masochistic”:
DMTD Ruling #040
Owners DAVID FRANKHAM and BRIAN CARMODY, who own the horse “SMOGCUTTER” entered to run in the first race at Del Mar Race Track on July 31, 2014, are fined ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS ($1,000.00)* pursuant to California Horse Racing Board rule #1698 (Failure to Start and Run – refused to run), for violation of California Horse Racing Board rule #1629 (Penalty for Late Declaration)."

What the frack- how could you not know?-
"08/28/143 AGUAYO HEARING
We held an informal hearing into case number 14DM029 which was a complaint against trainer VERNON AGUAYO for working his horse while it was on the Veterinarian’s List for flipping in the paddock the previous day (and was scratched from that race). He claimed that he didn’t know how badly the horse had flipped during the races and that had he known, he wouldn’t have worked the horse. Mr. Aguayo also stated that he didn’t know the horse was on the vet’s list even though the horse was a veterinarian scratch. The rules preclude working a horse 72 hours after being placed on the list. Decision to follow."

Should have been more of a fine, poor horse-
"08/29/143 AGUAYO HEARING
We issued the following ruling pursuant to the Aguayo hearing held yesterday:
DMTD Ruling #043
Trainer VERNON AGUAYO, who worked the horse “CHARMSTEALER” on August 8, 2014, while on the Veterinarian’s List, is fined FIVE HUNDRED DOLLARS ($500.00)* for violation of California Horse Racing Board rule #1866(d) (Veterinarian’s List)."

More discussion of new whip rule-
"08/30/142 JOCKEYS’ MEETING
We invited the jockeys to our office for a second week in a row to review races with an eye toward interpreting a possible new riding crop rule. For the most part, the Jockeys’ Guild and the riding colony are for the reform, are leading the charge and even have offered a new rule, and we wanted to discuss some examples of what would be considered violations. We had a great discussion and seem to have reached an understanding."

Not a good idea to curse in the paddock-
"08/31/141 MILLER/DENOVEL HEARING
We held a formal hearing today into a complaint (case number 14DM036) filed by the CHRB against trainer PETER MILLER alleging violation of CHRB Rule 1874. Mr. Miller also cross complained against paddock judge Karen Denovel. The complaint stemmed from an incident in the paddock two weeks ago. Both parties were witnesses and explained from their perspective what happened and what was said. Both accused the other of swearing and being generally abusive. The record was closed and a decision will be made in the near future."

Delay of race-
"09/03/143 RACE DELAY
The sixth race was delayed 13 minutes this afternoon when three horses were late scratches. #5 Increase flipped and became stuck under the gate resulting in his scratch. #11 Kenji’s Thunder got loose during the delay and was scratched. Lastly, jockey Victor Espinosa stated that his mount was kicked during the gate problem and therefore we scratched #6 Visitation. All jockeys were okay and all three horses had no more than superficial injuries."
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BlindLucky
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Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:44 pm

serenassong wrote:8/16 Delmar-
This is interesting- did not know trainer could check the "yes" box like this- must have really wanted the horse-

"CLAIMED HORSE
Trainer Kristin Mulhall, through disqualification, claimed the eventual winner of the first race, #1 ONTOLOGY. While galloping out Ontology’s jockey quickly pulled him up and dismounted. The horse was then vanned off and placed on the Veterinarian list for being unsound. The claim was not voided because the trainer elected to mark the “Yes” box on the back of the claim slip. The “Yes” box indicates, “the claimant elects to claim the horse regardless of whether the Racing or Official Veterinarian determines the horse will be placed on the Veterinarian’s List as unsound or lame.” Therefore, Ms. Mulhall is the new trainer for Ontology."
Yeah, she claimed him for someone as a stallion prospect, so I don't think they cared so much about the injury.
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serenassong
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Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:56 pm

BlindLucky wrote:
serenassong wrote:8/16 Delmar-
This is interesting- did not know trainer could check the "yes" box like this- must have really wanted the horse-

"CLAIMED HORSE
Trainer Kristin Mulhall, through disqualification, claimed the eventual winner of the first race, #1 ONTOLOGY. While galloping out Ontology’s jockey quickly pulled him up and dismounted. The horse was then vanned off and placed on the Veterinarian list for being unsound. The claim was not voided because the trainer elected to mark the “Yes” box on the back of the claim slip. The “Yes” box indicates, “the claimant elects to claim the horse regardless of whether the Racing or Official Veterinarian determines the horse will be placed on the Veterinarian’s List as unsound or lame.” Therefore, Ms. Mulhall is the new trainer for Ontology."
Yeah, she claimed him for someone as a stallion prospect, so I don't think they cared so much about the injury.
Would make sense- thought it was interesting, I cant remember that happening before- or even know about the "Yes" box- thanks for the info. :)
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Izvestia
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Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:16 am

Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:34 pm

Ontology as a stallion prospect??? Yikes. I guess he's by the leading sire, but come on! He's won a MSW and a claiming race - in which he pulled up lame in.

And then there's Jaycito - a G1 SW. By a non-commercially exciting stallion, but at least Jaycito had a career involving multiple wins.

There are some good Tapit's coming through the ranks, why oh why do we need a bad one at stud?
BlindLucky
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Fri Sep 05, 2014 8:42 pm

Izvestia wrote:Ontology as a stallion prospect??? Yikes. I guess he's by the leading sire, but come on! He's won a MSW and a claiming race - in which he pulled up lame in.

And then there's Jaycito - a G1 SW. By a non-commercially exciting stallion, but at least Jaycito had a career involving multiple wins.

There are some good Tapit's coming through the ranks, why oh why do we need a bad one at stud?
True, but think about it. He spent $20k on a graded stakes placed son of Tapit who's out of a stakes mare (minor stakes and placings, but she had a 35-6-7-9 record which isn't terrible). The guy probably claimed him to race until retirement to a regional market, but once he was injured, figured he'd take him anyway. It's not the worst idea.
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Izvestia
Posts: 3786
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2013 7:16 am

Sat Sep 06, 2014 7:37 am

BlindLucky wrote:
Izvestia wrote:Ontology as a stallion prospect??? Yikes. I guess he's by the leading sire, but come on! He's won a MSW and a claiming race - in which he pulled up lame in.

And then there's Jaycito - a G1 SW. By a non-commercially exciting stallion, but at least Jaycito had a career involving multiple wins.

There are some good Tapit's coming through the ranks, why oh why do we need a bad one at stud?
True, but think about it. He spent $20k on a graded stakes placed son of Tapit who's out of a stakes mare (minor stakes and placings, but she had a 35-6-7-9 record which isn't terrible). The guy probably claimed him to race until retirement to a regional market, but once he was injured, figured he'd take him anyway. It's not the worst idea.
I disagree, mostly because I know there are going to be a lot of Tapit's with better pedigrees and better race records retiring at stud, and this horse really doesn't have much going for him. I guess if they guy has his own mares and wants to just breed his own herd, it would make sense. It's not the best idea.
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