Why Are Connectionis "Mysterious" About Layoffs / Injuries?

[Curlin]

I've always wondered this about horse racing. You don't see this in any other sport. If a football player is injured, the media will report the extent of the injury.

In horse racing, however, because the athlete can't speak, his / her connections either say or don't say, but most of the time they don't say. Big Drama and Misremembered are two horses that come to mind. One had a long layoff, but ... I don't recall if anyone indicated what his injury was, and Big Drama hasn't run in ages - why? One of the few trainers I've heard state categorically the extent of one of his stars' injuries was Jim Cassidy (on TVG, I believe, and even the TVG reporter was shocked at how forthcoming he was).

I've had this discussion with a fellow TBCer and he thought it could have something to do with future breeding value, but I'm just not sure that's the most important reason. Anyone have any idea why all the mystery? Enquiring minds want to know.

[Somnambulist]

I have long wondered this, but generally I get the vibe that as a fan, I should know better than to ask why things aren't disclosed to us.

Racing is very detached from its fans.

[dustino140]

Sometimes I wonder if an extent of it is simply that nobody is asking the questions. Sure, I agree that sometimes injuries/layoffs are shrouded in a level of secrecy, but I also wonder if sometimes nobody is asking Fawkes the status of Big Drama. Or if they are asking, they're not really pressing for any information besides when he'll be back.

[gravano]

I think this is just one of many issues where racing's lack of a central governing body differentiates the sport from others.

[daisy]

#1, in the horse world there are at least three opinions for every two people. You would see people second guessing courses of action & treatment & race selection & retirement even more than you do now.

#2, Horses have residual value, human athletes don't. They can go on to make more money on the track, sell off the track as show or pleasure horses, and of course in the stud. Knowing specifics of every injury can have a detrimental effect on all three of the above.

[Pronzini]

Breeding, claiming and sales.

[Catalina]

Or, to put it into automotive terms - resale value.

[Sheepish]

I agree with the above statements, but on the other hand, I think sometimes that disclosing a whole lot of information will just bite you in the ***. You can't do a whole lot in the business without someone painting you as a mustache twirling villain at some point or other. Just look at what happened to Eight Belles trainer after she broke down in a very public setting. Why would anyone volunteer to put themselves under that sort of attack every time a horse in their care had an injury?

[Vertigo]

Breeding, claiming and sales.

This.

[gravano]

At the same time if the system were more transparent and owners were forced to share things like medical records (especially with a horse entered in a claiming race) there may be less suspicion.

[daisy]

In most states, I believe, a veterinarian may not release information on a horse unless the person who paid to get that information gives the OK. This comes up in prepurchase exams and horse owners can get testy when potential buyers vet the horse and then refuse to share the vet's report.

[BARNFOUR]

At the same time if the system were more transparent and owners were forced to share things like medical records (especially with a horse entered in a claiming race) there may be less suspicion.

hahahahahaha....now that is TOO FUNNY.If trainers were forced to share medical records
of horses entered in claiming races,you might as well do away with claiming races..

[Gemtwyst]

hahahahahaha....now that is TOO FUNNY.If trainers were forced to share medical records
of horses entered in claiming races,you might as well do away with claiming races..

And is that necessarily a bad thing?

[Pronzini]

And is that necessarily a bad thing?

.

Yes.

[dustino140]

And is that necessarily a bad thing?

Yep

[gravano]

hahahahahaha....now that is TOO FUNNY.If trainers were forced to share medical records
of horses entered in claiming races,you might as well do away with claiming races..

So you think owners right now are simply getting duped, and that's what's saving the sport? I don't think that's how it's working. People who play the claim game are a little smarter than that. But even if they were forced to release the records after the claim we would have a better system.

[Pronzini]

So you think owners right now are simply getting duped, and that's what saves the sport?

Wow did that ball go long!

What makes you think owners aren't in on and supportive of the status quo?

[Rick1323]

Every Trainer in the business cut his or her teeth on Claimers well before they made it big. Keeping everything under wraps is key in the claiming business. If you drop a horse down is to win, or because you want to dump it? If a horse is running off a layoff, is it because it was hurting, or to get ready for a big effort. Secrecy is bred into the business and always will be.

It also helps a lot that no one in the media cares enough to do any real digging. If Tiger Woods dates a porn star, everyone knows about it. If a horse disappears for a few months, no one but its few fans really cares.

[Pronzini]

There's some shenanigans sure. Claiming is a poker game and horses are the chips. But an even more important aspect from an owner's perspective is that claiming allows you to try and spot your horses correctly and give them the best chance to develop, build their confidence, mature and win. It's a way to face relatively evenly matched horses and, especially with young horses, to avoid the monsters before they are physically and mentally prepared to deal with them.

If you want to learn the claiming game, Jerry Hollendorfer is a master. Take Blind Luck for example. After she won her debut in maiden claiming by open lengths, he took advantage of the condition and ran her in a starter as opposed to open allowance. She won, built more confidence and eventually became the horse she is today. On a smaller scale, claiming allows small owners to move up the ladder incrementally without facing big dogs from Darley or Stonestreet. Believe it or not, horses can be well managed in the claiming ranks. Maggi Moss is another example of a person who knows her way around a condition book.

[GinTalking]

I think one of the problems is one that most fans don't think about and that is not every horse with an issue is so defined that a vet can tell the owner or trainer, "this is what is wrong with your horse and this is what it will take to fix it."

Even though I'm not in a barn every morning, I have heard enough stories over the past several decades and a lot of them really have no absolute answers.

And what vets wants to tell the owner of a G1 Champion who has a future as a stallion that his horse will be fine in four or five months. Suppose they push for him to go back into training, and he breaks down. They tend to err on the side of caution.

I know a foal who was stepped on by his mother. As he grew up, his foot looked a mess. Two vets and someone who does acupuncture were asked their opinions as to this horse's future. All three said he'd never make it as a race horse, probably not be able to do anything and he should probably be put down. He spent a couple of years turned out, growing up, and was eventually sold for $25,000 as a show horse up in New England and he's cleaning up in jumper classes. The people who sold him are happy; the people who bought him are happy.

Or the exercise rider who knows there is something wrong with the horse, but can't really pinpoint it. The vet watches it jog, flexes its joints, pushes and pulls on every limb and says, "I can't really see much." If you know the horse doesn't feel the way it used to, how confident would you be to get back on that horse every morning or send it out for a work?

Honestly, I think vets do what they can with what they have, but more often than not, all they can really do is cover their ***. I can think of a few horses who would have never ever passed the vet and yet they were pretty darned good race horses.

In this business, these folks are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Just suppose it is written that XYZ has this particular issue and he comes back in 4 or 6 months, and breaks down. What do you think will happen to the vet, the owner, the trainer or the jockey for having persevered with the horse? Crucified is my bet. So they are cautious particularly now because everyone wants to have information fed to them 24/7.

I'd almost guarantee you'd miss out on as many winners as losers if you knew everything that was going on with a horse, partly because so much of it is iffy information.

I heard someone say to a trainer recently that they'd heard the trainer had a nice horse and the trainer looked at the person and said out loud, "what do you know that I don't know?"

I think there is that rare moment when someone is successfully able to hide a really top horse in their barn, or at least there used to be, but today, with all kinds of people sitting around watching training, examining every word each person says ... wow, sounds pretty darned confusing to me. Good for you if you can make something out of most of the rumors, inside info (whatever that really is) and mumblings by writers. I'll bet we can all say something very positive (or negative) about every horse in a given race ... if we tried, well, not all that hard.