Zenyatta News

[BornToWin]

Found this story by Sam Walker in the Racing Post we "Zennies" can relish--"Zenyatta-mania grips the States after sweet sixteen"

"...The frenzy around the colossal six-year-old seems to be growing race by race and if marriage proposals are on the table this early in the campaign one can only imagine what the superstar can expect at the Breeders' Cup in November.

She is stealing hearts across the US and it is not only because of her flawless career record, nor just for the character she shows in playing up to the big occasion, prancing and bowing for the crowd, but it is also for what she represents as a female dominating in the predominantly male world of racing..."

"...This Zenyatta-mania is not a one-way street, however. Far from it. While the fans may follow her avidly, taking pictures, posting videos on YouTube, waving banners, cheering for her and shouting requests for her to 'dance', Zenyatta always, without exception, repays them with the performance of a true star.

With such supreme ability she did not need to create a niche for herself as a showgirl, but it all comes as part of the queen-size package that is Zenyatta - and America loves it.

Regular rider Mike Smith believes she is better than ever this year and, of Friday's success, said: "She did it well, well within herself."

Four-and-a-quarter lengths was the official margin back to Taptam, but if Smith was to have pressed the button the distance could have been anything..."

http://www.racingpost.com/news/horse...702602/latest/

[carbonite]

[quote author=Dave in TJMex link=topic=35061.msg930375#msg930375 date=1271265572]
3. I don't believe the Mosses and Z have "ducked" anyone. Nor have I ever argued (or intentionally implied) that Z faces "weak" competition. The fillies/mares in her races look weak because she always beats them easily, usually under hand rides.
[/quote]

I agree with what you say here. I don't believe it is easily reconciled with what you have said before. I would prefer to believe that your sentiments are what you say they are here.

[carbonite]

[quote author=Ms Hot Stuff link=topic=35061.msg930351#msg930351 date=1271263591]
Carbonite,

Your original post said to name fillies who had COMPETED in G1 races, NOT WON them.
[/quote]

Yeah. But just because you quit reading doesn't mean I had quit typing:

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930205#msg930205 date=1271217911]Make me a list of the number of fillies in the last 100 years who have competed in more G1 (or even more G1 and G2) races than Zenyatta. I'm not sure how many you'll find; honestly, I'm not sure if you will find any. But I know none of them will have been as successful as Zenyatta has been. None of them.
[/quote]
There's something to be said for not giving up too soon.

[Hermes Redux]

Depends on how you define success Carb. Silverbulletday had two championships locked up by the age that Z made her debut...
Azeri won 3 Older Filly or Mare Eclipses and HOY. Serena won 17 grades stakes.

I don't think her specific graded stakes tally is the measure of Z's greatness.

But the way she does it...is.

[carbonite]

You've been away, come back late, and not caught up to the conversation. This particular thread has been about the claim that Zenyatta has avoided quality opponents. It takes a remarkably good horse to duck quality opposition in Grade 1 races, over and over again.

[Hermes Redux]

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930670#msg930670 date=1271307180]
You've been away, come back late, and not caught up to the conversation. This particular thread has been about the claim that Zenyatta has avoided quality opponents. It takes a remarkably good horse to duck quality opposition in Grade 1 races, over and over again.
[/quote]

Translation: "Hermes, several of the posters here called me out on the inane assertion that Zenyatta has more Gr. 1 (or Gr. 2) wins than any other mare of the past 100 years, or has competed in more, because we all know that is all that determines the quality of competition (at least when it comes to my enduring defense of Anabaa's Creation) and really, it was another example of me hitting that post button too fast. Welcome back."

Thanks Carb

ps I bet Macho Again can beat Anabaa, especially now that she is preggers...

[carbonite]

The claim was--and remains--a better record against G1 competition (and if you want, G1 and G2 competition) than any filly in the past 50 or 100 years. In spite of the fact that the most vitriolic--like yourself--insist on denigrating her level of competition as substandard.

When you were gone, it was nice and quiet. Then, they let you out and we have to go back and forth like this. Relax. Take a pill. Settle down. You'll live longer and have fewer ulcers. Try meditation. It can't hurt.

[Hermes Redux]

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930680#msg930680 date=1271308966]
The claim was--and remains--a better record against G1 competition (and if you want, G1 and G2 competition) than any filly in the past 50 or 100 years. In spite of the fact that the most vitriolic--like yourself--insist on denigrating her level of competition as substandard.

When you were gone, it was nice and quiet. Then, they let you out and we have to go back and forth like this. Relax. Take a pill. Settle down. You'll live longer and have fewer ulcers. Try meditation. It can't hurt.
[/quote]

Translation: "Hermes, I'm back pedlin' as FAST as I can here, still trying to figure out why I think the Big Mare needs ANY defense except in my imagination, and I wish you wouldn't call me out as I think I'm able to steamroll most here. Please go away. BTW, how many Gr. 1's has Taptam raced in - do you have that handy?"

No, Carb, I'm afraid I don't. But I would say zero before April 9. I'm here for you.

[Curlin]

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930659#msg930659 date=1271305418]
[quote author=Ms Hot Stuff link=topic=35061.msg930351#msg930351 date=1271263591]
Carbonite,

Your original post said to name fillies who had COMPETED in G1 races, NOT WON them.
[/quote]

Yeah. But just because you quit reading doesn't mean I had quit typing:

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930205#msg930205 date=1271217911]Make me a list of the number of fillies in the last 100 years who have competed in more G1 (or even more G1 and G2) races than Zenyatta. I'm not sure how many you'll find; honestly, I'm not sure if you will find any. But I know none of them will have been as successful as Zenyatta has been. None of them.
[/quote]
There's something to be said for not giving up too soon.
[/quote]

There's also something to be said for selective memory, or rather how you parse what is saved to your memory bank. If success is measured by the percentage of races at high level a horse wins, then yes Zenyatta does exceed any other G1 level filly or mare in the last 1/2 century or more. She's won 16 for 16, and 14 of those have been graded stakes. That's 100%.

But if you measure success by the total number of stakes wins, Bayakoa, for example, had more total graded stakes wins. She just didn't happen to win them all. That, by your definition, makes her less successful.

And I don't know why I'm even bothering to address your snarky response because this entire thread has fallen into a morass of ridiculousness.

[Rick1323]

Morass....I have always liked that word. I can spell it and it is easy to pronounce. It would make a good name for a horse. We need to find more uses for that word.

[ElPrado]

This thread has descended into a morass of BS. :tongue:
Every time the subject is brought up it sinks farther.
Do you guys think you could maybe screech at each other in a PM? :undecided:
You are getting a bit carried away. olice:

[ezgoerbaby]

hermes. I missed you. LOL

[carbonite]

[quote author=Rick1323 link=topic=35061.msg930706#msg930706 date=1271332993]
Morass....I have always liked that word. I can spell it and it is easy to pronounce. It would make a good name for a horse. We need to find more uses for that word.
[/quote]

How about:

Face it: Zenyatta wins because she's got morass than the competition.

[ElPrado]

Face it. This has gotten a bit over aged.

[moonwalker]

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930729#msg930729 date=1271338738]

How about:

Face it: Zenyatta wins because she's got morass than the competition.
[/quote]

LMAO! Laughing Morass Off !

Mary MMM

[ManOTaz]

[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930729#msg930729 date=1271338738]
[quote author=Rick1323 link=topic=35061.msg930706#msg930706 date=1271332993]
Morass....I have always liked that word. I can spell it and it is easy to pronounce. It would make a good name for a horse. We need to find more uses for that word.
[/quote]

How about:

Face it: Zenyatta wins because [s]she's got [/s] her competitors see morass of hers than the competition.
[/quote]

[Curlin]

[quote author=ManOTaz link=topic=35061.msg930754#msg930754 date=1271341737]
[quote author=carbonite link=topic=35061.msg930729#msg930729 date=1271338738]
[quote author=Rick1323 link=topic=35061.msg930706#msg930706 date=1271332993]
Morass....I have always liked that word. I can spell it and it is easy to pronounce. It would make a good name for a horse. We need to find more uses for that word.
[/quote]

How about:

Face it: Zenyatta wins because [s]she's got [/s] her competitors see morass of hers than the competition.
[/quote]
[/quote]

I'm gratified to know that one of the words I used in a post has becoming the TBC Vocabulary Word for the Day! :grin:

[Jeff]

Since my post last night, several people have (while expressing disbelief that I would even contemplate the idea that Zenyatta is not ducking competition) brought forward names of fillies who have attempted more.

Just for the record, I mentioned Bayakoa and Paseana as accomplished distaffers who each had tried a relatively high number of Grade I and I races.

I do not personally share the views of many of those here who want to diminish Zenyatta. I was merely tossing out a couple of runners as a way to give the "discussion" some context.

Not that there is really a rational discussion ensuing, I'm afraid. For what it's worth, I lean much more toward carbonite's view than those of others here. Maybe not with quite as much certainty and conviction, but very much in that direction.

I felt, and feel, that Rachel had the better campaign for HOY honors. I do not feel she's a better racehorse than Zenyatta. And I wonder why some feel so obligated to keep trying to prove she is.

[Rick1323]

[quote author=Jeff link=topic=35061.msg930786#msg930786 date=1271346467]

Since my post last night, several people have (while expressing disbelief that I would even contemplate the idea that Zenyatta is not ducking competition) brought forward names of fillies who have attempted more.

Just for the record, I mentioned Bayakoa and Paseana as accomplished distaffers who each had tried a relatively high number of Grade I and I races.

I do not personally share the views of many of those here who want to diminish Zenyatta. I was merely tossing out a couple of runners as a way to give the "discussion" some context.

Not that there is really a rational discussion ensuing, I'm afraid. For what it's worth, I lean much more toward carbonite's view than those of others here. Maybe not with quite as much certainty and conviction, but very much in that direction.

I felt, and feel, that Rachel had the better campaign for HOY honors. I do not feel she's a better racehorse than Zenyatta. And I wonder why some feel so obligated to keep trying to prove she is.
[/quote]

I have been able to ascertain that it has something to do with morass. Still a preliminary conclusion though. I need to see the Beyers before I make up my mind.

[Curlin]

[quote author=Jeff link=topic=35061.msg930786#msg930786 date=1271346467]
I felt, and feel, that Rachel had the better campaign for HOY honors. I do not feel she's a better racehorse than Zenyatta. And I wonder why some feel so obligated to keep trying to prove she is.
[/quote]

That pretty much sums up how I feel too, Jeff.

Now back to her speculative schedule. I'd like to see 4 races in her before the BCC - 2 in her own division and 2 against boys. My choice for boys races are the HGC and SF. Against the girls, not sure. I don't remember when the Del Cap is scheduled, but the Beldame certainly could be one of the choices, unless she runs again in her now eponymous race at Oak Tree. I don't see her running again at Del Mar, period.