Ken Ramsey

Horsebagger
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:20 pm

Fri Dec 28, 2018 5:43 pm

http://www.thoroughbreddailynews.com/pd ... 181228.pdf

Inevitable, given this guy has bled millions of dollars annually for years chasing his gambling fix in this industry. (Something we all should thank him for, btw). I was a huge fan of many of his top runners and Kitten's Joy is on my short list of favorite runners AND stallions.

But this story is next level '#1 bullshit'. He's been 'taking money off the table for years', but it had zero to do with 'staying in the black'. Look at how many head he was carrying.......He's undoubtedly been getting crushed for a long time. The suggestion he'd entertain someone to come and lease part of the farm is funny (and mostly sad), but not much different than his long suggestion of looking to sell Kitten's Joy for a ridiculous price to a Euro buyer based on a manufactured six figure stallion fee.

Trumpian level narcissism without the money laundering criminal back story.

But we should all wish him many more years of relaxing happiness with his wife in his backyard heaven in Saratoga, even with a limited racing stable going forward. I hope he has no regrets given all his success.
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ElPrado2
Posts: 1954
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:45 pm

Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:29 pm

You couldn't hire enough hyenas in Africa to laugh at the notion of Ken Ramsey selling Kitten's Joy.
If he even leased him, he would move to which ever country it was. He leased him in Ky. He's close enough to avoid withdrawal symptoms.
Rick1323
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Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:00 pm

Sat Dec 29, 2018 10:32 pm

Con men come in all shapes, sizes and ages. But he has been good for the game and I wish him well......
Everyone come home sound.....
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Private Thoughts
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Location: Kentucky

Sun Dec 30, 2018 9:39 am

I for one am a fan of Mr. Ramsey. He’s done things his way and has the results, the trophies and the bankroll that shows he was doing something right.

I did a speech on him about 16 years ago, while working on my masters, and received the highest grade in the class.

Doing what he’s doing now is smart considering his age, ensuring his hard work and the foundations he laid will be there for future generations. He’s one smart cookie. 😉
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Curtis
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Sun Dec 30, 2018 4:52 pm

Private Thoughts wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 9:39 am
I for one am a fan of Mr. Ramsey. He’s done things his way and has the results, the trophies and the bankroll that shows he was doing something right.

I did a speech on him about 16 years ago, while working on my masters, and received the highest grade in the class.

Doing what he’s doing now is smart considering his age, ensuring his hard work and the foundations he laid will be there for future generations. He’s one smart cookie. 😉
I suppose Eugene Klein did a lot right too. Won a lot of trophies, etc. It’s also been bandied about how much money he lost. Has Ramsey opened his books?
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Katewerk
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Mon Dec 31, 2018 2:54 pm

Private Thoughts wrote:
Sun Dec 30, 2018 9:39 am
I for one am a fan of Mr. Ramsey. He’s done things his way and has the results, the trophies and the bankroll that shows he was doing something right.

I did a speech on him about 16 years ago, while working on my masters, and received the highest grade in the class.

Doing what he’s doing now is smart considering his age, ensuring his hard work and the foundations he laid will be there for future generations. He’s one smart cookie. 😉
HeGotOldTheyGotSold
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ElPrado2
Posts: 1954
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:45 pm

Mon Dec 31, 2018 10:39 pm

Another funny notion.
He still has so many he can run up to 3 maidens with different trainers in the same race. I've seen it this year.
Horsebagger
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:20 pm

Tue Jan 01, 2019 11:20 am

ElPrado2 wrote:
Mon Dec 31, 2018 10:39 pm
Another funny notion.
He still has so many he can run up to 3 maidens with different trainers in the same race. I've seen it this year.
Sounds like a profitable formula.
stark
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Location: SoCal

Tue Jan 01, 2019 1:00 pm

From Sol Kumin to Ken Ramsey as well as a few others along the way, your critique of their methods, wants and desires seems strange to me, perhaps it's out of jealousy that you speak?
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
Tessablue
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Location: Boston

Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:38 pm

Hey remember that time Ramsey threw a fit because his unsound horse wasn't allowed to run in the Derby? How many hopeless cases has he thrown into that meat grinder?

I can't think of a single reason why people would actually like him.
Horsebagger
Posts: 2014
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Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:30 pm

stark wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 1:00 pm
From Sol Kumin to Ken Ramsey as well as a few others along the way, your critique of their methods, wants and desires seems strange to me, perhaps it's out of jealousy that you speak?
Despite your Sherlock Holmes level powers of investigation, I don't give a flying f how anyone spends their money, or what they do or do not accomplish in the process. What I care about is bullshit, self-serving media reports that attempt to shade the truth and warp reality.

This is an impossible business to make money in from year to year, and I don't know that from questioning media accounts. Sure, there are moments of success in racing, breeding and betting, but no formula for consistently beating the odds year after year that I know of, but I'm still open to learning how it might be achievable, if it possibly exists. This business is an annual battle to limit losses. Which is specifically why I was curious if Kumin's 'hedge fund' efforts of ownership were profitable or not. Jealousy has nothing to do with anything. If someone wants to spend millions to get the owners title at Turfway Park one winter, God Bless. Just don't try and tell me he made money while doing it. Which is why I praised Mr. Ramsey for his contributions to the game while calling out the message from the article that he was a genius in how he ran his business consistently at a profit. He didn't care he was losing money, and neither do I. But you can go ahead and believe there is no connection to rolling back the size of his commitment in the wake of parting with his single most valuable asset as a sudden focus on keeping things in the black.

If that 'seems strange' to you, that's on you and perhaps speaks more to your own level of participation in the game.

Happy New Year.
stark
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Tue Jan 01, 2019 5:10 pm

There's two kinds of owners.
1. Hopeful of turning a profit in racing as their primary source of income.
2. Make your money somewhere else then spending it on a hobby such as horses, boats, planes, mistresses etc.

There are tons more of #2s than #1s that we ever hear anything about. Ramsey fits into that category, worked hard all his life, sold out at 60 for $39mil and said lets have some fun, horse racing here we come!

I have trouble finding any fault in that game we call life.

And you can't hold the #2s to the same standard as you do the #1s, and that's exactly what I think you're doing.
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
stark
Posts: 4497
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:55 am
Location: SoCal

Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:56 pm

Isn't it true that one of the very oldest jokes (truisms) in the Horse Racing industry is asking the question
How do you become a millionaire in Horse Racing, either by owning or gambling?



Start with two million.
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
Catalina
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Wed Jan 02, 2019 2:34 pm

stark wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 12:56 pm
Isn't it true that one of the very oldest jokes (truisms) in the Horse Racing industry is asking the question
How do you become a millionaire in Horse Racing, either by owning or gambling?



Start with two million.
So true! An old one, and still good for a chuckle.
Horsebagger
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:20 pm

Wed Jan 02, 2019 4:35 pm

stark wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 5:10 pm
There's two kinds of owners.
1. Hopeful of turning a profit in racing as their primary source of income.
2. Make your money somewhere else then spending it on a hobby such as horses, boats, planes, mistresses etc.

There are tons more of #2s than #1s that we ever hear anything about. Ramsey fits into that category, worked hard all his life, sold out at 60 for $39mil and said lets have some fun, horse racing here we come!

I have trouble finding any fault in that game we call life.

And you can't hold the #2s to the same standard as you do the #1s, and that's exactly what I think you're doing.

Name 3 owners under #1. I don't think they exist, and if they do, not for very long.
stark
Posts: 4497
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:55 am
Location: SoCal

Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:25 pm

I was thinking you might be on the list?
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
Horsebagger
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:20 pm

Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:08 pm

stark wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:25 pm
I was thinking you might be on the list?
My partner and I both have full-time jobs. Racing is a very expensive hobby and not remotely an avenue pursued for primary income. Not when we started over a decade ago, and certainly not now.
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Katewerk
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:31 pm

Horsebagger wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:08 pm
stark wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:25 pm
I was thinking you might be on the list?
My partner and I both have full-time jobs. Racing is a very expensive hobby and not remotely an avenue pursued for primary income. Not when we started over a decade ago, and certainly not now.
I understand this completely (as a competitive show dog breeder). What I do not understand is what sustains $100K stud fees and $4M broodmare purchases...
stark
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:01 pm

Katewerk wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:31 pm

I understand this completely (as a competitive show dog breeder).
My wife ju$t left for the $how in Palm $pring$ thi$ weekend. If $he'$ real lucky, $he'll come home with a ribbon or two!
I've found it easier to tear up tickets at 8/1 instead of 8/5.
Horsebagger
Posts: 2014
Joined: Thu Sep 12, 2013 7:20 pm

Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:02 pm

Katewerk wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:31 pm
Horsebagger wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:08 pm
stark wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:25 pm
I was thinking you might be on the list?
My partner and I both have full-time jobs. Racing is a very expensive hobby and not remotely an avenue pursued for primary income. Not when we started over a decade ago, and certainly not now.
I understand this completely (as a competitive show dog breeder). What I do not understand is what sustains $100K stud fees and $4M broodmare purchases...
There is still a lot of disposable cash in the hands of plenty of buyers to sustain high priced yearling purchases, validating the 6 figure stud fees. You just have to pair the right mare with the right stallion and then hope you get lucky enough to get a correct foal.

I personally believe the market maintains strength at the upper end of the market, but also believe we're on the cusp of reaching a peak (if we haven't already).

As for $4 million broodmares, you won't find me justifying that sort of purchase with any economic argument. To me, it's 90% vanity and for those who prefer to admire a beautiful mare in foal in a paddock than to examine a bank statement.
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